The Season 5 finale gave us the widest view yet of what’s been unfolding on the The Island, and for that, I’m thrilled. But the Season 5 finale also honed in on some of our character’s most petty failings, and for that, we’re both somewhat annoyed. Frankly, Jen was livid. I like the suggestion that we’ve been watching only the latest round in a perpetual battle between light and dark — one in which our survivors finally opened a “loophole” for the dark forces to gain the upper hand. I don’t like the idea that the huge, dramatic, cataclysmic detonation of the Jughead core we’ve been building up to all season came only as the result of more twists in the “para-love-ogram.”
Let’s start with what I liked. Though “like” is dependent entirely on the foolhardy presumption that my interpretation of what we’ve seen with Jacob is right. Based solely on the opening scene, no less. To wit:
Jacob is light, goodness, benevolence. His nemesis, yet unnamed, is dark, petty, judgemental. Perhaps for an eternity, they have battled on The Island. But they cannot vanquish each other directly. The Island is largely the chess board, and the pieces are men. Imperfect, flawed humans. By the time the Black Rock arrives, they’ve been through the cycle many times. Jacob summoned another group, believing they might avoid self destruction. Darkness says, “It always ends the same.”
So the Black Rock, the Dharma Initiative, perhaps even The Others, and most certainly the survivors of Flight 815… each group came to the island, struggled over leadership, and self destructed.
Richard Alpert, perpetual advisor, serves Jacob by trying to guide and protect whomever is the leader: Eloise (who Richard called his leader in 1977), Ben (whom Richard and perhaps Jacob felt was ultimately an inadequate leader), and Locke (who Richard presumed to be special, even if it was Locke that gave him that idea in the first place). Darkness, meanwhile, acts through visions, or actually possessing the form of the dead. Christian Shephard. Alex. Perhaps Claire. And, yes, the late Locke, whom we now know isn’t Locke. We’ll call him Dark Locke.
Jacob is compassionate and feels for these flawed people. He visits them, literally touches them, perhaps merely knowing their path, or perhaps steering them. However the cycle ends, he knows it must end.
But something happened with Oceanic Flight 815. Something about this last cycle was different. And the why and how are, most likely, part of what awaits in Season Six. Nonetheless, the combination of The Incident, of Desmond turning the failsafe, of Eloise sending them back on Ajira 316 but scattering them through time — this whole convoluted series events, the entirety of the last five seasons of “LOST” — has led us to the loophole. The loophole that allowed Darkness to vanquish Jacob, with Ben as his instrument.
What is the loophole?
I can only guess by guessing at the rules. Only the leader can enter the temple. There can be only one leader. And the leader, essentially, decides who wins. Darkness, through manipulating the leader with visions and the reanimated dead, has probably brought the leader to Jacob dozens or hundreds of times. Each time, the leader has probably arrived, ready to reject and kill Jacob. But once inside, alone, Jacob appeals to the leader’s better self, gives them a choice, and they always choose light.
Darkness found his loophole through Locke. I’m not sure exactly when, but Locke had been the key for a while. Locke eventually died. And, yes, Locke is still dead. But with his body returned to the island, Darkness was able to take the form of Locke, becoming Dark Locke, and bewilder everyone — including Ben and, curiously, Richard — with his knowledge of The Island. He asserts many times that he is the leader. And he repeatedly taunts Ben for never having made the cut with Jacob.
Dark Locke brings everyone to Jacob. He, the supposed leader, goes into Jacob’s lair, and insists on bringing Ben. Why? Because Ben is the leader. Ben’s been the leader ever since he returned on Ajira 316 and woke up in the infirmary, because Locke is still dead. That’s the loophole. And Dark Locke, having goaded Ben during the entire journey, looses his jealousy and insecurity and rage, and Ben, the leader, stabs Jacob and throws him into the fire.
The end?
Of course not. With his last breath, Jacob says, “They’re coming.” Who? My guess, perhaps obviously, is that “they” are everyone misplaced in time, back in 1977, who are near the Swan and subjected to the universe-twisting combination of electromagnetism and a hydrogen bomb blast. My guess for Season 6 is that everyone is reunited in 2007, but Darkness rules The Island, and the epic battle will be these imperfect, flawed humans trying to vanquish him.
But I could be completely wrong.
For example, where does the smoke monster fit? Is it an agent of Darkness? I’m inclined to think so, since it does stand in judgment of men, finding them unworthy and destroying them much as I imagine Darkness would. It could also be the agent through which Darkness assumes the form of the dead, such as both Alex and Dark Locke in the temple. Jen’s question, though, is how Ben became familiar enough with it to use it for his own means. It may be more likely that the smoke monster is a free agent.
Where do Bram and Ilana fit? Given the riddle, I guess they’re aligned with Alpert, and therefore presumably Jacob. What role will they play? I certainly hope it’s something more significant than teasing viewers with a mystery box for half a season. And if we now know that Ilana always knew Locke was in that box, she was obviously not surprised by seeing Dark Locke eating a mango in “The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham.” How can she not be surprised by Dark Locke, but Alpert be apparently merely suspicious? And could they actually be agents of Darkness? After all, in the opening scene in the ancient past, it’s Darkness who calls Jacob “my friend.”
And if we’ve actually been watching pawns on a chess board, manipulated by Jacob and Darkness, it’d be somewhat disheartening to imagine that the longstanding battle between crafty and clever Ben and rich industrialist Charles Widmore is essentially insignificant. There has to be more to it.
Yet, Ben was goaded into killing Jacob after decades of servitude simply by becoming a petulant, whiny, sore loser. Juliet reverses herself halfway through the “Stop Jack” mission, simply because Sawyer looked at Kate funny. And Jack admits that his talk about destiny was all a crock: he wants to detonate a deadly hydrogen bomb simply because he blew it with Kate. Sayid is shot, valiantly rigs the bomb to go off on impact, but it doesn’t. Juliet dies, but doesn’t, but does, because Jack didn’t detonate the bomb, she did. And Miles gets the throwaway line about how their actions are creating the events they’re trying to stop… all bringing us to the big dramatic blast that wasn’t, because it was effectively “defused” by all the character machinations that led up to it.
The preceding paragraph is essentially why Jen went to bed angry. Here’s hoping she’s feeling a little more charitable by the time we record our podcast.
Notes and Notions:
- Damon Lindeloff and Carlton Cuse hinted that the end of this Season 5 finale would be like the end of the Season 1 finale, and it was. Just as we saw nothing at the bottom of the hatch after Locke finally blew it open, we saw nothing after the bright white flash of Jughead. It’s a cliffhanger in only the faintest sense of the word. No tangible piece of what may come in Season 6 beyond “they’re coming.”
- If the “what’s in the box” teases weren’t enough, what’s the deal with Hurley’s guitar case? We know Jacob gave it to him, which is great, but… really? Will we just not know? Or will it be blasted into 2007 alongside Hurley to taunt us in Season 6?
- When Juliet said, “Live together, die alone,” didn’t you want to punch her in the face?
- Juliet’s death was wrenching, but probably would’ve been moreso if she hadn’t essentially dumped Sawyer two scenes earlier. It doesn’t look good for Sayid, either. And while it was good to see Phil get skewered, I really felt Sawyer deserved to have his death under his belt, rather than a random pipe.
- I’m not sure whether Jacob’s visits with all our characters were meant to direct them to their fates or change them. They made a point of showing him physically touch each of them, tapping Kate on the nose, holding young Sawyer’s hand a moment when handing him a pen. But it seems odd that Jacob helps revive Locke after falling from a high rise, but doesn’t do much more than give Jack an Apollo Bar.
- I really liked how Rose and Bernard were handled, even if I’m pretty sure this is the last we’ll see of them (beyond perhaps more explicit confirmation that they’re the “Adam and Eve” skeletons from Season 1). Their dismay at being found was hilarious. They got the lives they always wanted, they retired from the cycle of violence, and they’re happy to die as long as they’re together. Aww…
- We saw Vincent, too, but he’s now a mystery to me. If he survives the hydrogen bomb blast in 1977, he’s not likely to still be around in 2007. Unless he’s thrown through time along with Jack and friends. I can’t think of any other way Vincent makes it to the end of Season 6, as the creators seem to suggest he will.
- I liked how Bram called Frank a “yahoo.” Since it turned out that Frank was only pretending to be unconscious, I would’ve enjoyed having him pop up to respond to the word like he did in Season 4. He also got the great line, “In my experience the people who go out of their way to tell you they’re the good guys are the bad guys.”
- Talk about writing themselves out of a corner. Jughead already shrunk by several feet between “Jughead” and “Follow the Leader.” But after talking so much about its size and weight, turns out all we need is the core, which conveniently fits in a backpack. Now we can walk it over to the Swan!
- Some of the flashbacks were so short, and linked so plainly to the scenes that followed, I would’ve rather not seen them. Juliet’s parents got divorced, so that’s why she dumps Sawyer! Sayid watched Nadia die in the street, so that’s why he’s ready to die after being shot! Jacob recruited Ilana, and Jacob put Hurley on Ajira 316! It felt off.
- When Locke was thrown through the window, didn’t he bring a cascade of broken glass with him? The way he drops, singularly, with a thud before Jacob walks up seemed a bit strange. And were they suggesting Jacob saved Sayid’s life by pulling him back off the street?
- I can forgive Miles’ anvilicious “what if this causes the incident” epiphany because he also had the great line after Jack said the plan is not to go back in time. “Right, because that would be ridiculous.”
- Snarky Ben is fun. “I’m a Pisces.” Or, “I lied. It’s what I do.” Or when Sun asks Ben if he expects her to believe he doesn’t know about the statue. “Not really.”
- I liked that Sun found Charlie’s Drive Shaft ring in Aaron’s old crib, and that Charlie was mentioned in Jacob’s conversation with Hurley (along with Libby). Interesting how some long lost characters still get shoutouts, while many others don’t.
- Book: “Everything that Rises must Converge” by Flannery O’Connor. Interestingly, Jen’s working her way through an anthology of O’Connor short stories right now.
- Locations: Too many to list completely. Sun and Jin got married at the Byodo-In Temple in Kaneohe. Locke fell out of the Waikiki Landmark highrise on Kalakaua Avenue in Waikiki. Young Kate shoplifted from a small store near Haleiwa (the name escapes me at the moment, but we mentioned it on our podcast). Young Sawyer’s funeral was at a church in Ewa Villages. Hurley was released from the Oahu Community Correctional Center on Dillingham Blvd. Nadia was killed at the corner of Auahi and Kamani streets off Ward.
What did you think? Comment below, call the LostLine at (808) 356-0127, or e-mail us at lost@hawaiiup.com.
@moriah
but who is “he who will save us”
If they’re refering to Locke… i don’t think so…
If they’re refering to Jacob…he’s dead..
If they’re refering to Ben….lord help us.
Forgot to add – the Jacob and Esau story from the Bible has always lurked in the back of my mind in regards to Lost.
In the Bible story…at the urging of his mother Rebekah, Jacob pretends to be Esau, in order to steal from Esau Isaac’s (their father) blessing and birthright — which in theory Esau had agreed to give to Jacob. As a result, Jacob becomes the spiritual leader of the family after Isaac’s death and the heir of the promises of Abraham (Gen. 27:37).
Esau, naturally, is furious and vows to kill Jacob (Gen. 27:41). Once again Rebekah intervenes to save her youngest son Jacob from being murdered by her eldest son, Esau.(Wikipedia)
So I’ll call the other guy on the beach “Esau” for lack of anything else.
I did not in a million years guess that this episode would be a Jacob flashback! What a great beginning of the finale. I loved seeing the Black Pearl. (again a white/black reference) Yes, Jacob made it a point to touch everyone, and visit them at a turning point in their life, where they could choose which path to take. It also appeared that he brought John back to life when he fell.
Lock’s vision with the black and white eyes makes sense now.
I really loved this episode and one of the main reasons is that nothing was predictable. There are so many shows where I feel that I could have written the scrip since I know exactly what will happen. I know above else now that Damon and Carlton have a firm plan in mind and all will make sense one day. So many pieces coming together.
I have all the episodes from this season on tivo, I am going to watch them all again.
Now more than ever I think Rose and Bernard are Adam and Eve. They just want to die together.
One pet peeve – why does it all come down to Kate!! Jack, Sawyer and Julliet all doing everything because of her.
Can’t wait for the podcast or Ryan’s blog.
Knives – totally thought of you when Sayid got shot. He better live! I think Jacob saved him, he knew that the car would hit Sayid as well.
Who broke the circle of ash? I think this removed Jacob’s migrating sanctuary and allowed Dark Heart to exercise the loophole.
I guess those black and white stones from the cave and the chess, back gammon , countless other good vs. evil references came into play. 🙂 Very The Standish. Especially with the black and white shirts defining Jacob and Esau. But, great episode. I’m guessing that Sayid, Juliette, and probably Jacob (if he didn’t die before the explosion) will survive in some way. Locke…well, dead is dead and I could live with that.
I agree with AnnLoise that I am not convinced Jacob was the Good guy in how he interacted with the Losties before their Island time. But Jacob being the good guy does seem to fit the thematic parallels with other stories they have set up.
Any chance Rose and Bernard are the ‘Adam and Eve’ from Season 1?
OK, so what if Anti-Jacob has somehow been banished from the island but has found a way to return only by inhabiting the body of a dead body (i.e Jack’s Dad and now, Locke) and has been doing so for centuries?? Hmmmm…
Loving Rose and Bernard and Vincent, living their lives. So sweet and made me feel better.
Loved the comment above saying Ben has a Salieri complex…I thought the same thing, Rich!
Love, love, love!!!
Heading into this episode, I had concluded that Jacob was a puppet-master who had used time travel to orchestrate events and control everything. This AJ character (though I’d prefer to call him the antagonist) actually seems to be that person—creating an existential struggle between destiny/fate/control and free will.
It turns out that Jacob seems to be the advocate of free will, and thus in his time travels seemed to play more of a merciful but unobtrusive spectator. This seems consistent with the Others and their free spirited alliance with him (whereas Dharma—and Widmore—seem to be more about control and manipulation).
I can’t quite sort it out, but it seems possible that antagonist AJ—not Jacob—controlled much of what we think of as the island itself (the black smoke, Christian, etc).
But, even if this is all right, where the heck does it go from here? How in the world can they wrap this up—the personal and existential elements—in an intellectual and emotionally satisfying way? I’ll be hugely impressed if they can.
Ben.
Ben is “he who will save us”.
He has always LIED in the shadow of the statue.
@ Rich in Cleveland
I’m not even sure anymore if that was Jacob’s cabin. Maybe the ash was the keep the anti-jacob in it. That’s why when Locke was taken there, he communicated with the AJ and got set on this path he’s on now?
Cause apparently Jacob has always lived in the statue.
One more thing, the Lost Logo reversing from black to white was pretty cool, wonder what it might mean, a clue for next year? I think the island will be back in 2007 again, what will the ultimate goal be? Save the island? Leave the island? What was jacob?
What if “they’re coming” refers to Christian and Claire rather than the people in 1977? Unlikely, but possible.
Did anyone catch what was said in Latin between Ilana and Ricardus/Richard? Also, what was the Greek embroidered on the cloth Jacob was weaving?
For Dan, a repost of what i had earlier up the list here.
Thank god for super Lost fans:
When Richard is asked what lies in the shadow of the statue
a nice Lost fan (drockin13 over at 4815162342.com) got the subtitles
“ille qui nos omnes servabitâ€
and from what he looked up it pretty much means
“He who will save us allâ€
Did anyone else notice how Locke was confused when they took him to the Giant Foot? If he is the ‘Dark One’ from the early days, wouldn’t he have been familiar with Jacob Being Here? Also, after Jacob was stabbed and he started to say ‘They are Coming’ Locke seemed to change from the vengeful personality to sounding more like the old one when he asked ‘What was that?’. I guess once Jacob was a goner he was directionless like the old Locke, even though he was not really Locke.
Ok, Ryan and Jen – you guys totally have your work cut out for you with this one. How do you recap this finale?? Seriously, this was the most intense 2 hours of TV I’ve ever seen, and the best finale Lost has had. The ending was absolutely gut wrenching, and I don’t think I breathed at all for the last half an hour. Absolutely brilliant.
I think I need to let this all sink in…my mind is fried!!!!
@Jesse Again
Who knows? Even though Lost is rarely obvious, in this case, I’m going to go with the most obvious: Jacob. He appears to have always had his home there and it appears that Illana and Richard are not with this character who is posing as Locke but actually with Jacob. While Jacob is dead, he might be the true Christ figure that Lost fans seem to keep looking for (Christian Sheppard, John Locke … it seems like there have been others as well). As people have already mentioned here, Ben appears to be taking on the role of Judas …
No matter who it is, I really like the line. I’m not a religious person. I’m more agnostic than anything. But for some reason, I really do enjoy seeing religious symbols and parallels in Lost.
@AnnLouise
You make a lot of really good points. Even though there’s all kinds of talk of black and white in terms of backgammon, the stones with Adam and Eve and even Jacob wearing white with the Anti-Jacob/Devil character wearing black, I don’t think that much of anything on Lost is truly black and white. I usually see a lot of gray in terms of the characters in the show. That said, my gut feeling right now is that Jacob probably is good and does believe in free will but will clear paths for people to make decisions for themselves. It just so happens that our Losties all chose the path that brought them to the island. Sayid is the biggest toss-up for me, though, since Jacob’s interference led to Nadia’s death. I’m not big on the idea of a “vengeful God” but Carlton did say in the last podcast that he views Sayid as a bad person … he kinda took it back, but kinda not. I personally love Sayid so I don’t like the idea of him being bad and I like the idea of Sayid being the recipient of Jacob’s vengeance even less but at this point, who knows. (I feel like I keep repeating “who knows.) I have a feeling that whether or not Sayid survives, we’ll find out more about that encounter that led to Nadia’s death. Or maybe it is just as simple as saving Sayid’s life?
@ HeyKir in NYC
Great Amadeus reference. Couldn’t say it better myself.
There is so much on my mind, and I really want to write so much, but I need to digest this episode.
I love reading all of your comments. It really helps me center myself and reevaluate my own conclusions.
I noticed nobody has really stated that
WEVE SEEN THE F***ING STATUE!!!
They’ve given us so many things.
But I digress
As I said, I’ll compose myself and write my theories and reactions later this evening perhaps.
Bottomline is.
LOST is the greatest SHOW this century. It has us all by the horns! And no matter what happens…I know that the Creators/Producers/Writers will take care of us, because look:
Theyve given us 5 INCREDIBLE seasons and OVER 100 HOURS of amazing story telling, mythology, and wonderful characters what well never forget and feel close to.
____________
All i have to say right now, is I have to life the next 8 months wondering if Sayid will make it… That is a burning feeling that I havent really swallowed up yet. But I’m overwhelmed with the bigger picture and the things that truly and upmostly matter ‘in the end’
I love LOST
@AnnLouise
I missed your Esau post before I posted my last. Thanks for sharing that. Very interesting and also goes nicely with @HAM in MO’s theory.
I wonder now, who will lead the other? Could it be Ben? Perhaps “what about you” meant more than we thought. Maybe Jacob was asking Ben what his destiny was. Because really, if we go by the war idea, we have the army of the others, and in the other corner…. “esau” as or with the smoke monster? what kind of battle will that create?
My brain is tired, so my posts aren’t really fully formed thoughts right now. But I have one question for everyone:
Did anyone see this coming?
We are all huge Lost fans but I don’t think any of us could have predicted this finale. This is the genius that is Lost, this is why we keep watching.
Holy Crap!!!! This is by far, the best episode of Lost EVER. My mind is still trying to take it all in…
I do have one question, though… why couldn’t ‘the other guy’ kill jacob? and how did they get there? (ok, maybe more than one question…lol)
It seemed like an awfully easy death… a couple stabs to the heart and bam. So was it a ‘rule’ that kept other guy from taking him out ages ago?
I, too, believe Richard was the original Jack Sparrow (lol Drew!). So, is he mortal? was Jacob mortal? are they/were they just in some time loop where they never age?
The only negative thing I have to say about this episode was Juliet’s flashback was very strange! The house looked like something in this time period…. her parents clothing, everything. Would’ve she have to have been born in the late 60’s, early 70’s?? That seemed a little weird.
There are way too many good things to say and my brain hurts too much to try to type anymore but I CANNOT wait for the podcast!!!
AWESOME, AWESOME, AWESOME!!!
What in the world are we gonna do for the next 8 months?! 🙂
WHAT?!?!?!?!
That episode was CRAZY!
My 2 cents – it’ll send them back to the present but it won’t change the future. If they changed the future then it creates a paradox – if they never went to the island then they never went back in time and set off the bomb – and if they never set off the bomb then they crashed on the island.
Is Sayid dead? Or at least dying still? As invested as we are in him, I’d almost rather keep Juliet. Or is all of this a moot point because the “game changing moment” is so game-changing that we’re not even asking the right questions.
I don’t know, if we keep thinking about all of this, it’ll either start to make sense OR we’ll just get a headache.
oh, and one more thing… as a female about the same age as kate, one of my favorite parts of this whole episode was that she stole a New Kids on the Block lunch box!!!! LOL!! that was great!! 🙂
Another site has the latin quote as
“ille qui omnes servabit” = that which will protect us.
@ Carol…
No. Im sure that NOBODY did. Thats why its so incredible
And FYI, LOSTEPEDIA calls the AJ ANTI JACOB “Jacobs enemy”
whatever floats ur freighter
After watching, I think it is incredibly likely that the other guy on the beach is the Smoke Monster. Jacob is the one that believes in people and tries to guide them. The Smoke Monster is the judge. One light, the other dark. He may very well have been “borrowing” the body that we saw. Just think, all of the info that has steered Locke has come from Christian Shepard, who said he spoke for Jacob, and what we now know is “Possessed Locke.” When Locke took Ben to the Smoke Monster, he know exactly where to go. He was nowhere to be found until after Ben came back out. What did Alex tell Ben? She told him to do EXACTLY what John Locke says. We know with certainty that the Smoke Monster can take the forms of either dead on the island, or people from someone who he is judging’s past. All he did was use those abilities to find his loophole and get rid of his nemesis.
Two ethereal adversaries, one light, one dark, needing a vessel in order to do harm. Richard needed to collect the dead bodies and burn them because the dark god could use their bodies as vessels in an attempt to find/kill Jacob. Charlie and Libby were seen after they died, could they have been vessels used by the darkness in an attempt to persuade certain actions by the losties? Not all those that died were needed (Paulo and Nikki, Shannon but Locke did see Boone again).
In an effort to set all of this in motion, the impending war was always going to happen; the losties were merely pawns, a necessity in order to make the killing of Jacob possible. The visits, the time travel, the specific characters, all needed by Jacob and his adversary. Locke, the man of faith, was easily manipulated. The smoke monster (Jacob’s adversary), peered into the soul of John Locke and saw the kind of man he was and knew this was his vessel. He granted Locke the ability to walk, giving him confidence that the island healed him. He visited Locke, posing as Christian Sheppard, telling him he had to die, even going as far as using Locke’s body to tell Richard what he needed to say to the “real” Locke. Locke had to die, not to save his friends but for Jacob to die and for the war to begin. Every action, every piece of knowledge, every possibility, five years we have watched a chess match between Jacob and his “friend”, using the losties. The crew of the black rock (the others) verses the Dharma was a precursor to the war that is coming between Jacob’s followers and his “friend”. There are so many insignificant items that the writers knew we would focus on, all the while setting us up for an epic battle of good versus evil, perhaps between two gods, and using humans for our moral ambiguity. The book Jacob was reading on the bench Everything that Rises Must Converge contains many short stories, two of which are titled Revelation and Judgment Day, which could be poignant, the first five seasons show the revelation of how we came upon judgment day, the final battle. But that is just my crack pot theory so far. I intend on going back and watching every episode again. This was by far THE best episode of LOST.
I think Ben is the “loophole” that Jacob was talking about. After Ben was shot by Sayid, Richard took him to the Temple saying he would be changed and different and the temple made him special in a certain way and granted him powers that noone else had, namely to kill Jacob. Like Richard told Widmore, Jacob told him (Richard) to bring Ben there and save him. Jacob then realized his mistake, that he had created the loophole, the way that he could be killed. Because of this, Jacob never directly interacts with Ben, fearing Ben’s power to kill him. In the end, Jacob’s ignoring Ben causes Ben to kill Jacob, which would certainly be very ironic (in trying to save himself, Jacob actually caused his own death).
I also think that the black-shirt-guy/Anti-Jacob/Esau embodied Christian Shephard before he took John Locke’s form. It was Anti-Jacob that caused all the things to move and fly around and that said “Help Me” to Locke when Locke and Ben visited the cabin, to make Ben even more jealous and frustrated at not being able to communicate with Jacob (setting up his later killing of Jacob) and also to set John on the path of believing he is somehow special. When Locke went to see Jacob in season 4 and was told that he “had to move the island” it was actually Christian Shephard/Anti-Jacob whom he met and Anti-Jacob told him that he had to move the island knowing that Ben would instead do this and ultimately predicting the events that happened off Island (Ben Kills Locke, Ben returns on the Plane) so that he (Anti-Jacob) could miraculously “return” as Locke. Anti-Jacob in the form of Locke impresses Ben and ultimately uses his guise as “returned Locke with a purpose” to con Ben into killing Jacob. Anti-Jacob/Esau also knew that Locke had been set up as the leader, so Richard would not suspect Locke wanting to see Jacob and would wilfully lead Locke/Anti-Jacob right to Jacob, which Anti-Jacob/Esau could probably not do himself.
I hope that jumbled theory made some sort of sense, it’s probably riddled with holes, but it’s just a thought. We won’t know until in 8 months anyway >_<
Also, did anyone notice that the Statue looked a lot like Tawaret (Hippo Face, Two Ankhs, 4 Toes, etc…). I know this was a popular theory when we first saw the back of the statue and I think there’s probably some truth to it seeing that Tawaret is also the Egyptian goddess/guardian of Fertility, etc…
Love the Blog and the Podcast and everyone’s insights and thoughts! Can’t wait to hear Ryan and Jen!
Ok…. I rewatched the last 10 minutes of this episode…
and I have just come to the incredibly depressing and slightly angering realization…
WE KNOW NOTHING OF NEXT SEASON…
does the past change, does the future change, who’s alive, who’s dead, who’s here, who’s there, what’s up, what’s down, left is right, right is left cats are sleeping with dogs…
it’s MADNESS!!!
I found the reincarnation reference:
Ben’s Van: http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Reincarnation#Ben.E2.80.99s_van
“Canton Rainier”, an anagram for Reincarnation
http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/lostpedia/images/6/67/Bensvan.jpg
AJ reincarnated (an)other body(ies).
@Jesse Again
I’m going to predict that we see Patrick Duffy step out of the shower. 🙂
Quick Picture comparison for the Statue/Taweret:
Statue:
http://getlostpodcast.iimmgg.com/image/3a9b326e7702a50c7effad666c6204dd
Taweret:
http://www.zarifas.com/images/products/h/hippo_goddess.jpg
I think it’s pretty clear?
At first I really enjoyed this episode but on further rumination I am disappointed. Not because of the cliffhanger, but like Danie said, all this Jacob sudden reveal is too much Deux ex Machina. So now we see he (Jacob) is impacting on everyone’s lives…i just don’t buy it. I hate the introduction of so radically new concepts and characters this late in the endgame. I fear that when LOST is all said and done, there will be so much left unanswered.
Again when Jacob interacts with our Losties, i don’t always see the defining moment. His interaction with Sawyer was big, but the cameo with Sun’s wedding was negligible.
I thought it was comical that with only minutes to spare, Miles was the only one to come up with the idea that perhaps the H-Bomb is “the incident”…!?
Someday I want to hear an interview from the producers and writers and find out how much of this was from the start/planned and how much was “on the fly.” Was Jacob really supposed to be revealed this late in the game…? Was this show always supposed to be about Jacob (White Shirt) and Anti-Jacob (Black Shirt)…
It would be a trip if the final season had the Losties landing in LA, but everything is screwed up so that their new mission is to get back and make it truly right and that the plane was supposed to crash…
carol….I noticed the logo switch color reverse too. Have the teams been switched, the games been changed.
We saw jacob finally.. But he dies already? Why do we see jacks eye opening again at the very end of the show… The ending was definitely a big clue…where was Christian or claire 🙁
It was nice to see rose and Bernard and vincent! Where has vincent been? I loved it! Will rewatch a bit tomorrow.
Well…hmmmm….well…..hmmmm…ok……hmmmm….um….
ok…..so much to say.
First of all I loved that we found the Drive Shaft Ring- I have thought about that sitting there in Aaron’s cradle a lot.
Did you all notice the rainbow behind Sawyer on the beach when they first see Vincent? I loved that. Another biblical reference- God’s promise after the flood….and of course “Somewhere over the rainbow…”
I am wondering what Eloise might have to do with Pod-Locke (as I like to call him)- because she was the one who insisted that Jack bring him and put his father’s “ruby slippers” on him for the plane ride…did she want to kill Jacob too- in some retribution for her own son’s death?
I think the Jacob/Esau connection seems pretty obvious- but I don’t think its clear who is bad and who is good here. I mean pod-Locke certainly doesn’t seem good- he seems very tricky and he killed Jacob (his brother?). But there is surely more to the story. I like this website for the bible story of Jacob and Esau- its for kids and they tell a nice story (I have 5 kids!)
http://www.essex1.com/people/paul/bible24.html
I do think the fact that Jacob kept talking about Free-will and Choice- is meaningful in the story- that all along the way people make choices and he is somehow trying to prove that no matter what happens- we make progress- but it always ends the same way. So are they looping through the same old story over and over- making progress- whilst always ending the same way? Mass destruction? UNtil he finds the “loophole” that allows him to kill “his brother.”
I loved when Jacob said to Ben “What about you?” There was something even loving about that- it didn’t sounds like someone sarcastically saying “Yeah what about you you nimwit” it was clearly a question back to Benjamin.
Juliette seemed a little “Sylvia” in this episode- she seemed like she couldn’t make up her mind and one look from Sawyer to Kate would end up send her reeling towards a hydrogen bomb? I agree with whoever above said that some of that didn’t play as well as it could have – needed more motive- she seemed a little “pod-like” herself in this episode.
Cant wait for the podcast…and Knives- will you be selling “Save Sayid” Dharma Shirts during the long hiatus??? 🙂
Well, definitely a “fork in the light-socket!”
@target242
There was a moment during the show where I had a similar thought. When Jacob went to visit Illana in the hospital, I thought to myself, “ya know, it’s unfortunate that we hadn’t at least seen Jacob at some point in the show even if we had no idea that’s who he was.” I wonder if the Lost writers were too worried about giving away his identity if they put him in anywhere? You’ve also got to figure that in a TV show like this, it would be hard to hire an actor who, by appearances, is just an extra only to hire him again later as such an important character, ya know what I mean? Anyway, I know it seems like I’m just making excuses for those in charge of the show but at this point, I do want to cut them slack. I mean, it’s not like we hadn’t known about Jacob for a while. We just hadn’t seen him. It’s not the same as an actor coming on the show and playing a character we’d never heard of.
Maybe when they release the 10 year anniversary deluxe blu-ray (or whatever format we have in 10 years) edition of the series, they’ll have placed the dude playing Jacob into the background of various characters’ flashbacks digitally 😉
…Oh and I loved seeing baby Kate and baby James…and did anyone think of Charlotte when Jin said that Jacob spoke really good korean? (at his wedding)
Question:
Did anybody get the Greek from Jacob’s weaving?
My thoughts:
I’m hoping that next season isn’t a reset. It seems the writers went out of their way to stay in line with events that we know will happen. Chang does lose his arm. Radzinsky stays alive so he can end up a Swan-stain, and the Swan site goes nuclear, thus insuring concrete bunker in the future.
This episode also strongly hints that Christian could be a bad guy. In season 3, I assumed the ash circle around the cabin was there to keep Jacob in. Now it seems that it was there to keep someone out. Did Christian infiltrate the cabin? Did anti-Jacob put him up to it? We’ll see.
Also, nice touch in having Jacob in white and anti-Jacob in black at the beginning.
One final thing. I am hoping that since this episode seems like the season one backgammon conversation between Walt and Locke writ large, we will see Walt again. Maybe Young Mister Dawson is the only one who has the power to revive/replace Jacob and set everything back in balance.
I just had a thought … was did Walt tell Locke he dreamt? That a bunch of people were standing around him on the beach, wanting to kill him? Or had already killed him? Either way, that looks like the scene we saw tonight. Either with Locke’s real dead body or perhaps with Anti-Jacob comes out still in Locke’s form.
“Walt informed Locke that he had been having dreams of him back on the Island wearing a suit, surrounded by people who wanted to hurt him.”
http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Walt_Lloyd
Walt in interesting because he can see the future and warns people throughout the show of things about to happen- even the time he says “Their coming” to Shannon (I think he says it backwards and creepy and it gave me nightmares) It is similar to the same warning Jacob gave Pod-Locke tonight.
If the Jacobs Enemy/Locke II isn’t locke… then how was he wearing Christians shoes?
Yeah, I was thinking about who the “they’re coming” tonight could be referring to, which made me think of Walt’s “they’re coming” and how ambiguous that was … which made me think of the dream.
@Knives Monroe
How does he look like Locke at all? Locke’s body was in the box the entire time. I’d guess that Anti-Jacob just needed Locke’s body on the plane to make people like Ben think Locke really had come back to life. If he can take on Locke’s form, it’d probably be easy to fake the shoes too.
The Christian Sheppard we see on the island has to be connected to Anti-Jacob since he told Sun and Frank to wait for John Locke, right? Which has me worried for Claire.
I think that Jacob is “What lies in the shadow of the statue”. Even though he is dead now, whenever they came up with that ‘friend confirmation’ phrase, he would have be considered one who protects/saves them. I think it is clear that he always lived near the statue, and even though there is only a food left, he lives in its shadows inside.
I am baffled by the connection between Richard Alpert, Jacob and the new group of people. It seems that it might be logical that Richard Alpert came onto the island on the Black Rock. At first I thought that Richard’s answer to the friend confirmation phrase was in Spanish and that would explain why the new group knew him as Ricardo as well. But then I realized the answer was actually Latin, and according to Lostpedia the Black Rock was a British ship. So how does Latin play in? It still seems likely that English is not Richard Alpert’s first language, and the new group of people are either long lost crew from the Black Rock who have not aged, or more likely, exploiting knowledge somehow obtained from the earlier days of the island. Maybe they are working for Charles Widmore after all and they learned enough to get them where they are from the Hanso family journal.
Jesse Again got me thinking about how little we know about next season. Here are some things that I’m wondering if we’ll see in terms of Jacob and Anti-Jacob:
What if Anti-Jacob tries to take Jacob’s form when we next see him? Will we recognize the truth? Will Richard et. al. know the truth or will he be able to kill Ben and come up with a story for the Locke-facade he had been using? Or will Ben redeem himself by telling everyone that this new guy isn’t really Jacob? Will there be some kind of revisit to the doubting Tom story that Ben tells Jack, except this time with Ben as the doubter if and when the real Jacob returns?
Ok, my mind has got to stop racing. Putting on some soothing music and trying to walk away for the blog 😉
Our TV cut out for about 30 seconds when Jacob said “So you found a loophole” and came back when Ben started going off on Jacob. AAAA!!
What did we miss???? Pleeeeeease!!!
pretty amazing, lots of info to process. I think we went this whole season without seeing Claire…???? i guess the anti-jacob is just as knowledgable as Jacob to know all these things about Locke’s history. When i found out locke died i was sad but then happy when i found out he came back to life but now he is dead again. Is the real John Locke gone for good??? thats it and season 6 is too far away.
That was an amazing how. Does anyone think that the statue looks like “sobek” from egyptian mythology? Google it. . . .
Thoughts and Jacob being in white and his “friend” being in black. A simple illusion of good and evil? The “friend” couldnt kill Jacob so he has Ben do it while taking the shape of Locke.
“They are coming” ..was that Jacob telling the “friend” that Jack and gang are coming back ..or forward to the island’s present time?
FUNKY-ben asking jacob why he never showed himeself to ben,and why he never ask to see ben or let him come see jacob.
only question i have is how did rose and bernard not get found in 3 years,
they seem to have a nice cabin,and food so why did no one come across them.