Through the Looking Glass
“LOST” has spawned a million theories. A show grounded in simple, human drama, but swirling with so many mysterious and supernatural elements that you know anything can happen. And yet, I don’t think anyone could have imagined where tonight’s episode has taken us. We were promised a “game changer,” and a game changer we’ve got. We know we’re only halfway through the grand arc of “LOST,” yet we’re given a glimpse of what we thought was the natural endpoint of a “stranded on a tropical island” story. Suddenly I’m willing to entertain even the most ridiculous, crack-pot theories. Because I have no idea where “LOST” will take us next.
I admit, I’m a spoiler fiend. And even Jen, who valiantly went spoiler free the last few weeks, couldn’t resist. We read about the big twist, “the snake in the mailbox,” last week. Tonight’s season finale, fortunately, was still powerful enough to leave us speechless. But we do somewhat regret depriving ourselves of the chance to have our minds totally blown. Lesson learned. At least for Jen.
Alas, Charlie’s reprieve last week was short-lived, and he dies… having passed on one of the biggest twists yet. His character’s journey was a roller coaster, with some seriously deep dips… but the writers did well by him in the waning weeks of this season. It’s tough enough to lose someone who has been aboard since the beginning, but he met an especially bittersweet end. No, it didn’t look like Charlie had to die. That burst porthole would have taken half an hour to flood The Looking Glass, more than enough time for him to stroll over to Desmond and help him into some SCUBA gear. So he chose to die. On the debate over “free will versus destiny,” I guess he falls in the latter camp.
Hurley’s bus-powered rescue was spectacular. His moment of triumph was extra sweet, after he was cruelly rebuffed by his friends tonight (and last week as well). And when he called Jack with the news? That he saved everybody, including Sayid, Jin and Bernard? Probably one of the best rushes I’ve ever felt with “LOST.”
Speaking of great moments, Alex and Rosseau’s reunion was something we’ve been waiting for since Alex surfaced in Season Two. It was as powerful as we’d hoped, and one that hopefully opens the door to some great character development in the seasons to come. I dare say never in the history of television have a mother and daughter been more perfectly cast than Mira Furlan and Tania Raymonde.
Wonder of wonders, Walt returned, ushered in by the mysterious whispers. He restores Locke’s hope at the very moment he’d lost it all. It was good to see David Malcolm Kelly again… but he’s definitely not a kid anymore. The odd angle and strange voice effect didn’t help. Still, he made sure Locke survived and remains a central character in the “LOST” master plan. His return, in the midst of Ben’s collapsing authority, is a tantalizing tease for Season 4. And his line to Jack, resigned over his making contact with the ship, seemed to strike the deepest of any uttered on this show:
“You aren’t supposed to do this.”
And Penny’s brief conversation with Charlie proved that Naomi isn’t who she said she was (and proved that Ben wasn’t entirely lying). Ben’s desperate last pleas to Jack, that making contact would be the “beginning of the end,” also seem to have been borne out, when we see Jack — OFF THE ISLAND! — broken and desperate and now yearning to return.
I… I don’t know what to say. Jen?
So they’ve been rescued.My biggest fear is that the series would end MASH style: with tears and hugs and emotional dialogue about fear and destiny. I could see them all getting on the boat and riding off into the sunset, and it scared me.
It’s safe to say that that’s not going to happen now.
We’ve thought we were headed somewhere, but we were wrong. I admit, this season took forever to get started. I was wondering what the whole point of the six-episode “pod” was, and while I think it might have been dragged out a little bit far, I can still see in retrospect where they were going. Ben and company might be the “good guys” after all. The finale made me reexamine everything we’ve learned about all the characters so far, especially The Others.
Season three of Lost, to me, is one of the best seasons of television ever.
Notes & Notions:
- Who died? Whose funeral had no visitors? Who’s neither family nor friend to Jack (and elicits a sneer from Kate)? Benjamin Linus seems a likely guess. Looks like this will become one of the key mysteries of the seasons to come. And I suspect the journey to the answer will be even more delicious than learning how Locke ended up in a wheelchair.
- Jack’s crack about his dad being drunk, and presumably alive, was very, very curious. Was he just so whacked out on drugs that he forgot Christian Shepherd was dead? Or is dad… not dead? (Jack also seemed rattled when the pharmacist said she’d call Christian to verify the prescription.) In fact, Jack’s sorry state seemed to be a continuation of the downward spiral we’d seen in his pre-crash flashbacks. Kate, meanwhile, seemed to have settled down with someone, and didn’t appear to be in prison or on the run. I’m not a “time loop” fan at all… but these are pretty juicy morsels for someone to suggest that some of the things we’ve seen happen now didn’t happen.
- The code to disable the jamming signal was “programmed by a musician.” Was that a big clue, or just another way to cement in Charlie’s mind that it was his destiny to do what he did?
- Some fantastic lines. Rose threatens, “If you say, ‘Live together, die alone’ again, Jack, I’ll punch you in the face.” And Juliet’s quip about building runways for aliens was priceless.
- What is the deal with Mikhail? (Cyclops!) He just won’t die. At this point, I’m fairly sure we’ll see him again in Season 4.
- Links: “Through The Looking Glass” discussions at TheFuselage.com, Lost-Forum.com, and Pop Candy
May 23rd, 2007 at 7:40 am
Less than eight hours to go till the show airs here on the east coast. I can’t wait. Usually I tape it and watch it in the a.m. but not this week. I’ve read the big spoilers but I still am eager to see how it plays out on the screen. I know we’ll all have a lot to talk about tomorrow and for the next 8 months. Gosh 8 months till the next episode. That seems like an eternity.
I read somewhere from an unconfirmed source that Lost will be doing most of its filming in California from now on with just some exteriors shot in Hawaii. I haven’t read that anywhere in the Hawaii papers as I would think I would if it were true. I think people tied that together with Terry selling his house which I’ve read conflicting stories on also. Some say it’s just not true.
Ryan and/or Jen have you heard anything about principal production relocating to the mainland? I’ll only believe it when I hear it from official ABC sources. The Hawaii TV/film industry would be taking a major hit.
John
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:02 pm
I have litterally scratched all the hair from the top of my head. How can this be the most confusing thing I have ever seen, but yet be THE BEST SHOW EVER!!!!
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:03 pm
I saw it. Good episode W00t
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:06 pm
Mind Blowing.
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:09 pm
I just got finished watching and I am stunned, and reeling and I LOVE how they give us these mind-blowing puzzles to mess with us over the summer and I cannot say enough about the scene at the beach with Hurley!!!!!!! The most exciting part except for the very very end reveal.
Holy cow. Well played. What a /wonderful/ payoff!
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:09 pm
Holy crap!!!!
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:13 pm
that was incredible! cheers to the producers, actors and writers who make this kind of show possible!!!
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:13 pm
What was in that newspaper?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:15 pm
I can’t wait to discuss this episode once our friends in Hawaii have seen it. So many wonderful scenes and so many hard to watch scenes. It played out exactly as the spoilers had indicated but I still am not sure what to make of it. Great acting by so many of the actors. Jack was amazing and I don’t usually like his character. What a great job by Dominick. Wow, I can’t even imagine where to begin. So many questions. So much to think about.
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:16 pm
Tom,
Don’t spoil this for those who haven’t seen it, but I also am waiting for a screen shot of that paper. Someone has to have it.
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:23 pm
Hurley killed someone? Dude, no way. Still pretty cool moment though, I was cheering when he appeared in the Volks. Locke killed someone? Dude, no way. I hope that chick had it coming to her. I guess Locke can always say, “Walt made me do it.” Speaking of Walt, was it the island that made him grow up so fast when it’s been like, what, a couple of weeks? The island kills pregnant women and causes premature puberty. I’ve just given away The Secret.
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:24 pm
Tom,
I actually know Jen and Ryan personally. Heck, I jusy had dinner with them two weeks ago. They don’t want spoilers here especially right before folks on the west coast and Hawaii see the episode. Please stick to their rules.
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:25 pm
DON’T READ IF YOU HAVE NOT SEE THE EPISODE
Do we assume that the appearance of Walt is an apparition?
Who is Kate with- obviously not Jack?
Personally I think that this was a great episode, a real game-changer, however will people still tune in in the long run now that the losties are off the island? Maybe, well obviously for the season premier next January, I cringe at the thought but for me LOST is LOST on the island. How are they going to transition to the real world or post-rescue in 2005
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:27 pm
honestly, it was great but i was disappointed with it. It didnt strike me silly like the season 2 finale. I mostly enjoyed Locke’s performance. Jack’s “scenes” were amazing. Downright amazing!!!!
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:28 pm
DON’T READ IF YOU HAVE NOT SEE THE EPISODE
Anyone have an idea about why Kate’s freckles were gone in the future?
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:28 pm
guys…i hate to say this…but where i can i download the podcasts. I haven’t been to the site in months, but do not see where i can DL the podcasts to listen to. please help me out
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:31 pm
Gabe,
I think the problem we’re all facing is that we’re used to cliff hangers on continuing dramas, but normally we only have to wait 4 months not 8. I think most Lost fans will be crazy waiting to see how they deal with tonight’s big change in the show.
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:32 pm
Potential spoiler alert below. Do not read if you dont want vague references. I’m trying to be really vague though, but I wanna know what other people think about this one part.
About halfway thru the ‘flashbacks” I started wondering about when they were occuring. Then as soon as Jack made the call at the end, I KNEW who was going to get out of that car. I was yelling the name at the TV. But what i didnt see coming, was what he told them about leaving the island.
WOW, my mind is BLOWN.
On another note, to me the most confusing part of this episode was, (im censoring this part for spoiler protection), why is Jack telling the other doctor to call his father?
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:33 pm
SPOILER
I must also admit my friend and I were watching the episode and when Jack said to the new chief resident, ” You don’t know what I have been though” got my friend thinking that this flashback was in the future. Also I thought the producers confirmed that Christian Sheppard was dead? How could Jack make references to Christian twice in the episode that would insinuate the opposite?
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:34 pm
why would somone click through to here if they had not seen the episode yet??
andrew called it, an absolute game-changer. brilliant. “heroes” inspired?
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:37 pm
patrick:
Heroes doesn’t hold a candle to this show. I watch Heroes. I know Heroes.
This is no Heroes.
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:39 pm
Tom.
I don’t set the rules here. Jen and Ryan do. It’s sad that you refuse to post according to their requests. I’m not trying to impress you, but since you raise the issue, have YOU actually been to the beach camp site on O’ahu? Have you stood in the middle of the village of the Others?
I haven’t just “met” Jen and Ryan. They are friends and that’s more than you can say. All I’m asking is that you stick to their rules…not mine.
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:42 pm
One question, or thought rather…I was confused as to how Naomi could know about Penny and Desmond after Penny told Charlie she knew nothing of the sort- could Penny’s Father be behind Naomi’s crew? Similar to how he paid Desmond off during an earlier flashback?
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:45 pm
As much as I like reading it..I guess it’s time to find a new board..John, can you take another step up on your ladder..not high enough..bye bye
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:48 pm
Jennifer,
Thanks for being vague enough to abide by the rules here. I think you are right on target. I think that there’s a Paik/Widmore connection that we’ll learn more about in the upcoming seasons. Ben has always claimed that he’s one of the “good guys” and I’m not convinced that in the end he’s not telling the truth. As we saw last week the folks who controlled Dharma must be pretty nasty and yet, powerful.
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:49 pm
John Fischer you seem to be coming off as a spoil sport. The Numbers Forums and the Fuselage are currently down. Lostpedia “has a problem” and millions of us fans are dying to discuss this absolutely mind blowing finale. I don’t see anyone checking this site out who A) hasn’t seen the episode or B) doesn’t know to be on the lookout for spoilers.
I know you are merely doing your “job” but it almost seems a bit overboard considering the momentous impact of this episode. I’m sure you are a great guy and have good intentions, but I’d caution against being so hardcore. On that note, how hardcore is Sawyer for his cold hearted promise kept to Tom and how about Super Ninja Sayid with the double ankle neck snappage. Dayum. Love this blog and the show and any audio/spoilers I get from Ryan or Jen- many thanks.
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:51 pm
bryan- i meant as far as the flash forward (and hurley reminded me of hiro). love both shows. totally different but both taking tv storytelling to new interesting places. was really impressed by matthew fox tonight. the dark future jack.
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:56 pm
Jackb,
I apologize if I seem to be coming off as a spoil sport. It’s just that spending as much time as I do in Hawaii I know how hard it is to resist reading spoilers.
It’s definitely a tough decision that each of has to make after viewing Lost. I have no “power” to stop anyone from posting spoilers. I just know how I felt a couple of weeks ago when the episode was spoiled for me here when it was just 5 p.m. in Hawaii.
May 23rd, 2007 at 6:07 pm
So the cast aways are going to be “LOST” in the world. How did Dharma get Jack’s father back? Or replicate him? Or earse the minds of everyone at the hospital who knew him? Did anyone in the States know Christain had died?
Who’s funeral? Lockes?
Kate and James Ford? Is that who she’s with?
And now that (at least) Kate and Jack are off of the Island, are they being monitored?
Wow.
May 23rd, 2007 at 6:10 pm
John, I appreciate your consideration, but we’ve always encouraged folks to post here as soon as they’ve seen the episode, fully understanding that we wouldn’t get to enjoy it ourselves for five more hours. Heck, I love that the discussion here is well underway before we even start to process what happened.
I’m certainly not spoiler averse (I was all over AICN the moment that hit the wires), and Jen usually can’t resist reading here… but we still enjoy the show, and we love the conversation.
So, everyone, let ‘er rip!
May 23rd, 2007 at 6:14 pm
Ryan,
My apologies then to all. I sincerely thought you didn’t want spoilers here. I’ll retreat to my normally comfortable background.
May 23rd, 2007 at 6:16 pm
Who is in the casket?
May 23rd, 2007 at 6:17 pm
awesome finale
heroes finale suxd
this is how you do it
time anaomaly
wow
great episode…
May 23rd, 2007 at 6:43 pm
Anyone seen a screenshot of the obituary clipping? They show it close up near the end but I haven’t found it online yet. I feel like you might be able to make out the headline/name.
May 23rd, 2007 at 6:51 pm
SPOILER
I think it is Ben who is in the casket because it was a relatively small casket plus he is the only person from the island who I could think of that no one would want to see after the rescue. Moreover, Jack would go and visit him out of respect, for Ben was right about Jack regretting leaving the island.
May 23rd, 2007 at 7:09 pm
Despite the facts that I also read the spoilers a week ago, I found the episode mind-blowing and pretty exciting. It was quite touching to see Charlie go as well as to see Danielle touching Alex’s face for the first time. I also found it incredible when Hurley ran over Ryan, and when Ben got beaten both by Jack and by Alex.
I have the same question Andrew has: what’s up with the Christian Shepherd references? The producers have assured us that he is dead. Was Jack so out of it, with the pills, that he did not know what he was saying?
My other question is about Naomi: who is she really with? Could Ben be telling the truth about other people being the bad guys? He and other Others have said that before.
To me, the fact that the show might move forward in time, to events happening off the island after ’some’ of the Losties have returned home makes perfect sense. I have always been confident in thinking that the show could not end (in 2010) with the Losties being rescued. So, this was a very nice way to introduce that other chapter of the story. However, I do not expect the next season to happen competely off the island, after ‘the rescue’. It will probably continue jumping through time to flashbacks before the plane crahs, on-the-island event, and after the ‘rescue’ scenes.
My only disappointment: Jack is still alive and will continue so for a long time. Despite the wonderful performance of Matthew Fox, I dislike Jack very much. Even after being a “hero” for getting off the island, he is still a very disturbed individual, and even became irresposible and selfish (he was not like that before the plane crash). I would have loved it if the episode would have been Kate-centric instead; and it would have been great to see her meet someone else at the end (BTW, I am convinced the “he’ she refered to was Sawyer; they make it off the island and start a life together). But LOSt is still my favorite TV show, and I find it very thought provocking.
The thrid season is over. Many more new questions have been posed. We will starve for answers for eight months. AWESOME!!!!
Namaste,
May 23rd, 2007 at 7:13 pm
The funeral is Ben’s…He is not friend or family to Jack. And Jack was upset because he wouldn’t be able to get back on the island. He was hoping Ben would help him find a way back. Kate’s freckles are gone because she is wearing makeup.
May 23rd, 2007 at 7:18 pm
I think it’s Ben’s too. That’s the only significant person we know of that makes sense so far. But there are three more years…
So what. We think Kate’s with Sawyer in real time then? Craziness.
May 23rd, 2007 at 7:33 pm
Wow. Pardon me while I put my brain back together.
Who is in the casket? Who could it be other than Sawyer? Who else could elicit such a strong reation from Kate? Isn’t it plausible that James/Sawyer would revert back to his antisocial persona, and push Kate away? (Plus, he’s been acting really wack since he exorcized his Sawyer demon…) Andrew suggested it was Ben in the casket, but I truly doubt Jack would shed tears for Ben — and let’s hope his demise is sooner rather than later!
OK, everyone, break into discussion groups till February…
May 23rd, 2007 at 7:53 pm
I forgot to ask: Why can’t Mikhail die for good? When he first met Charlie, Hurley, Jin and Desmond ( afew weeks ago), he said: “Go ahead. Kill me. I already died once this week.” I thought it was funny then. Now, I just think he is creepy.
May 23rd, 2007 at 8:08 pm
Great episode. Crazy future flashed with Jack…had me until the end, even then, with makeup, took me a bit to realize it was Kate.
Can’t wait till next season…should be good.
Aloha
May 23rd, 2007 at 8:14 pm
OK… I got the part where they have been saved and are now off the island where the real-world rules apply. So, how come Kate is not in prison or on the run? I guess we have to wait to find that out, too.
May 23rd, 2007 at 8:25 pm
So all I got from checking out the frames of Jack holding the newspaper clipping was “Los Angeles” as the headline and “Man found…downtown…” then “The body of a man…” and then I have no idea. So it seems less like an obituary and more like a straight up story from the paper. Even with the bluriness, I couldn’t make out any proper/caps names.
Also, my theory is, since Sawyer’s now killed Sawyer and realized his life’s goal, he’ll start putting things in persepctive and turn out to be Kate’s guy at home, real time. Also, she’s totally pregers with his kid. Remember what Juliet said about the chances of getting impregnated on the island?
Ah. Seven month wait. Best.
May 23rd, 2007 at 8:28 pm
And what happened to Richard Alpert, Cindy, the kids and the remainder of the Others? Was the whole Island evacuated? Did they force Locke to leave the Island? Did they take Ben?
Charlie could have saved himself, IMHO, by swimming out the broken window or simply exiting the radio room and closing the door behind him. It seemed to have a wheel lock on both sides. At any rate, even if he had left the door open it would have taken a whuile to flood the entire hatch and he and Desmond would have had plenty of time to don scuba gear and escape. What say you all everybody?
I think it was either Ben or Locke in the coffin. Clever Damon, Carlton and the rest of the stellar cast of writers and producers. Since now we are all psychologically in the “future”, think of all the story telling left to be done…is 48 episodes going to be enough? How did they actually exit the Island? What happened (and how long has it been) to drive Jack to suicide? What is the state of our other Losties and even rescued Others like Karl and Alex? Was Kate pregnant? Will we ever see Walt and Michael again? Wow…brilliant, just brilliant!!!!
May 23rd, 2007 at 8:35 pm
One more thing, I think that the world they return to is not the world they left. That is why Jack refers to his dad as if he were living and Kate is not on the run. Also notice that Oceanic Air has apparently given them all “Golden Passes” that must be good for anywhere, anytime for life.
Was Jack wearing the beard as a disguise. If you notice, people recognized Jack not as one of the survivors of Oceanic 815, but as the “hero doctor”. I wonder if their rescue was covered up or if people still think that the plane went down and there were no survivors.
May 23rd, 2007 at 8:40 pm
George, sorry to tell you this, but Ryan and Jen haven’t podcasted for Lost in over a year. It was a sad sad day…the day the Transmission died. People still beg them to resume, but we all respect their reasons for stopping the podcast and are thankful that they keep up this forum. They do a great job!
May 23rd, 2007 at 8:45 pm
even thought it seems it was ben on the casket, since it seemed to be small, and since no one where there. i thought it would have to be one of the losties for jack to think kate would be there. think about it, why would she go to ben’s funeral. i could be either sawyer or locke, since they are the ones without family, but i highly doubt kate would be so cold about it if it was sawyer’s funeral. actually, from the things she says, it seems she ends up with sawyer.
i think it must be locke, kate is a bit indiferent, cause in the end, at least in the eyes of the losties we get crazy locke, that doesnt want them off the island. it would explain why jack was emotional as well, now he can see locke’s point, he wishes he was on the island as well.
as for kate, she seems to be doing fine. apparently still living as a fugitive but now with sawyer by her side. and she doesnt seem to have any doubts about going back to the island.
a great episode. i wish i hadnt read a few spoilers before. next year i’ll be 100% spoiler free!!
May 23rd, 2007 at 8:51 pm
The newspaper was about the memorial services for Ben…I’m just guessing but it makes you think. Any ideas as to what the heck is going on on this show???
May 23rd, 2007 at 9:01 pm
Given the shift in perspective at the end of this episode, I’m going to say maybe Ben IS one of the “good guys”, although at the moment he is in a desperate state because the island is now vulnerable to as yet unknown forces, unknown to us at least. The shift in time (reveal at the end) is also a shift in space. I mean this: the show all started with an extreme closeup of Jack’s eye and the camera has been zooming out to reveal more and more of the island ever since. Up until now once the plane crashed all the story arc has taken place on the island. The only time we’ve seen the larger world has been in flashbacks, and once when Penny’s guys in the arctic station picked up the energy surge. Now it seems possible the Lost story will continue to include the island but go beyond it as well. Whether it’s Penny’s father or whoever, forces, larger forces in the world at large may be descending on the island and Ben knows it. See ya in 8 months!
May 23rd, 2007 at 9:07 pm
how can ben be one of the good guys?? really? he shot locke. and he ordered tom to kill sayd, jin and bernard.
thats not a good guy. ben’s out of his mind. he may have a point about not wanting them to leave the island. but a good guy? i dont think so.
May 23rd, 2007 at 9:18 pm
Will we ever learn the secret of the Smoke monster or Jacob?
May 23rd, 2007 at 9:25 pm
First of all Patchy scared the hell out of me with that sinister grin when he held the grenade to the window and blows it up….does that mean he “dies” again? or can he swim to safety? But seriously….has the “zombie season” been on the whole time? And why “Good vibrations…”A song about someone in love with a beautiful girl and when the guy in the song closes his eye he is reminded of her and she goes with him…”I don’t know where but she sends me there….”Penny related??? Is that why they picked that song? Strange for a code.
Which were mostly the others.
So yeah I am just even more confused still too…and yeah are those at the beach getting saved too?
Charlie didn’t have to die…but he picked his destiny that desmond had told him.
The newspaper clipping and the funeral….It could be anyone…I am not sure yet whose. And Yay hurley….
Agggh….summer now I have to wait…
I will rewatch the episode tomorrow….
At somepoint my three year old said “what happened to Locke?” and then thankfully she went to bed before all of the killing sprees
Anyways…later
May 23rd, 2007 at 9:26 pm
oh i liked the alien shout out by juilette too
May 23rd, 2007 at 9:36 pm
So, did they get rescued before the big tsunami of 2004, assuming that they still were in 2004 when they were rescued?
May 23rd, 2007 at 9:39 pm
Was ben from new york? the newspaper clipping said someone from newyork died at 4am on something like grand ave…and the casket seems small too. Who was from newyork…?
May 23rd, 2007 at 9:43 pm
Maybe it was Vincent!
(I should really go to bed now…)
May 23rd, 2007 at 9:43 pm
I have a feeling it’s not ben because the first few words are “the body of Jo…….of Newyork was….shortly after 4am in the…Grand…ave….man at The Tower….that was all i can make out…
May 23rd, 2007 at 10:04 pm
I really have a feeling the name is johnathan…at one point the article says johnathan’s loft.
May 23rd, 2007 at 10:04 pm
I really have a feeling the name is johnathan…at one point the article says johnathan’s loft.
May 24th, 2007 at 12:35 am
John,
Have you watched the episode yet so that everyone can post info on it?
May 24th, 2007 at 12:51 am
I’m glad I resisted the spoilers. Overall, the finale was excellent. However, the “game changer” was a bit underwhelming for me - initially. Maybe I’ll change my mind after another viewing. If anything, it was borrowed from the season finale of “Galactica” where they jump ahead a year into the future, but that wasn’t a surprise.
May 24th, 2007 at 1:12 am
Given the numerous story lines about time loops, C&D’s comment about “somewhere in the space-time continuum,” etc., I have an awfully hard time believing this particular off-island outcome is written in stone. If “you aren’t supposed to do this,” then don’t we need to experience the “course correction?”
I think a tease to a possible end at the series halfway point is interesting, but I really don’t get the idea that many seem to be implying, that is, a switch to heavy emphasis over the next 48 episodes about post-island denouement. There is a *LOT* of stuff still to cover regarding the island. And I’m not sure that the post island stuff by itself will be able to sustain the high level of mystery and viewership.
I wouldn’t be surprised if the next season starts out by wiping out that possible ending right off the bat.
May 24th, 2007 at 1:37 am
Connie in alaska you said
“If you notice, people recognized Jack not as one of the survivors of Oceanic 815, but as the “hero doctor”. I wonder if their rescue was covered up or if people still think that the plane went down and there were no survivors. ”
Jack was the hero doctor because he saved two people from a car crash and he was on the news. its not that it was a cover up, its more probable that this maybe some time in the future…..
May 24th, 2007 at 1:59 am
Does anyone else continue to notice that only the Losties have killed anyone…The Others have not even still…..
May 24th, 2007 at 2:07 am
Every time Jack used his cell phone, I was getting annoyed because that model cell phone was not made back in 2004/before. Looking back, I should have been aware the Lost producers rarely make prop miscues. Anyway, I was completely shocked when Kate appeared.
I think the only person that makes sense to be in the casket is Ben. He has no family (no way Alex would have shown up) and no friends. It fits that Jack is remorseful about his death since it was juxtaposed to Ben saying that he was making a mistake leaving the island.
Last night was the best TV I have ever watched. Hands down, the best twist ever. The writers are brilliant.
And the previews of the show were great- I was thinking the finale was ending with the others taking over the “losties”, how wrong I was.
May 24th, 2007 at 2:14 am
The casket was definitely small. They generally don’t make a coffin smaller for an adult even if they are short. But for a child the casked is usually smaller. So my guess is Walt is in the coffin. I always wondered why Ben would have let them leave the Island, he is scared of Walt’s power.
http://losteastereggs.blogspot.com/2007/05/funeral-parlor-and-coffin.html
The way Charlie died was stupid. It was already established a person could hold their breath long enough to get down there, and going up is quicker, so pretty sloppy writing here. I wish the writer’s would have found a more plausible way for Charlie to die being hero. I also found it inconsistent that patchy would be worried Ben was trying to kill him, then he would kill himself, just to kill Charlie,which at that point was pointless. The signal was off, so it made more sense for him to wait until Charlie left and swim back in and turn it back on. Unless, Patchy knew he wouldn’t die from the grenade?
May 24th, 2007 at 2:16 am
That was an awesome episode. I know that I heard the collective shouts and hoorays from all of you!
Sayid is a badass and Hurley rocked it out!
I’m going with Ben in the casket. I think Jack would cry for him if he thought Ben was his only way back (and he did seem desperate to get back).
I think that Penny and her dad have seperate searches going on. Penny’s dad hoped to get rid of Des, but apparantly not far enough-with $$ at your disposal, like P has, she can search all day/night.
And, that could expain why Naomi’s photo of Des and Penny was different (someone said before that a her photo looked different than Des’s original-put together by P’s dad to help Naomi find Des and get rid of him again??).
At first, when they first revealed Naomi I said (jokingly) to my husband-’it’s Sanjaya!’ Collective retch. Haha
Patchy creeps me out. It seemed that he was holding the grenade when it blew up, but obviously he’s still here, so..too bad he won’t be shark bait..
Damn it Charlie-he must’ve done it because he thought if he did survive, it would jeopardize Claire’s rescue.
Anyway, the epi was great and now we have more new ?s..
Bye!
May 24th, 2007 at 2:36 am
What an episode!! The “flash-forward” bordered on creepy for me after I figured out we had gone forward and not back.
My big theory after watching last night: Nobody dies or stays dead on the island, unless their death is at the hands of someone who is NOT an Other and it’s not a head shot (like the skull in the pit with Locke).
This would explain why Mikhail keeps on going like the Energizer Bunny. I have a feeling we will be seeing some dead “Losties” resurrected in the new season. Complication of eternal life is that you cannot give life - give birth. (Everything has it’s price.)
Jacob… He’s the original Other and the help he wants it that he wants to die.
Charlie, poor Charlie. Hoping that because Looking Glass is tethered to the island, he’s not dead-dead either.
Jack’s future fuss is all about he got everybody off the island, and then realized that it was the wrong thing to do. He says he flies repeatedly on the Golden Pass, hoping the plane will crash so he can get back there suggests that nobody knows where the island is and they got off the island without a way back. Golden Pass = compensation from Oceanic to all those that survived the crash.
Who died? I’m hoping it was Ben. But then, if Ben went back with the Losties, how would they explain him? He wasn’t on the flight… Has to be someone on the flight.
May 24th, 2007 at 2:40 am
correcting myself —
“their death is at the hands of someone who is NOT an Other and it _IS_ a head shot”
May 24th, 2007 at 2:46 am
I knew I would be in a state of grief, sort of, this morning. I love Wednesday nights and I love Thursday mornings - reading this blog and everyone’s comments and theories. Now - 2008 seems like an eternity.
I fully anticipated the demise of Bernard and Rose since they had been absent all season and popped back up as the season was coming to a close. I’m relieved that they are still alive because they are awesome supporting cast!
Connie, I think Charlie chose to die because of Desmond’s “flashes”. Charlie thought that by him seeing through what Desmond told him would happen - he was ensuring Claire and Aaron’s rescue!
I was a little disappointed that Tom got killed - only because I think he adds an element to the show - he was like the Sawyer equivalent of the OTHERS with his quips and lines.
It was a little odd seeing Ben so “beaten” down… literally. He’s so cunning - I just found it out of his character for him to walk right into getting ambushed by the LOSTIES.
I’m totally puzzled by how Penny had a transmission that made it to the Looking Glass. How did Naomi know so much about Desmond and Penny? How did she have that infamous photo?
I wish there had been somewhat a final moment with Albert and The Others that would have left us in suspense regarding them. Also, I wish somehow Jacob would have had something to do with the finale.
All these things being said - I think it was an incredible twist and an incredible show. I’m going to try and go back this summer and watch all three seasons to see if I see things that I’ve missed… which I’m sure I will.
Oh yeah, so is Juliet definitely 100% with the Losties now?
Leeann
May 24th, 2007 at 2:49 am
I was so spoiler free going into this, until one of my friends at my finale viewing party said, “I think this is happening in the future” within the first 2 minutes of the show. ARG! I couldn’t get that out of my head the whole finale!!!
It was still amazing though. What I am so curious about though is what has happened to Jack between being rescued and the time we saw last night that makes him think he should have stayed on the island??? I guess that’s what the next 3 seasons will be about. Are the flash-forwards going to go in reverse now? So the next flash-forward we see in Episode 1 of Season 4 takes place before the flash-forward we just saw?
Someone mentioned “where did Kate’s freckles go?”. It seemed to me that they tried to do some age makeup on Kate and Jack to make them look 5 - 10 years older, so her freckles are covered in makeup.
To whoever asked where the podcasts went, Ryan and Jen haven’t done the podcast in a while (since about January of 2006?), but Ryan still maintains this nice forum for us.
RIP Charlie!!! I cried like a baby! I thought I was ready but I wasn’t!!!
May 24th, 2007 at 2:56 am
One more thing…
Was it just me, or did the woman in the hospital bed look like the woman Sawyer scammed & got pregnant? What was her name… ?
May 24th, 2007 at 2:59 am
I believe it is Locke in the coffin. Everyone of the Losties was broken in some way before they came to the the island - and it was Locke who realized the power of the island gave everyone the chance to reclaim a path to a new life. Maybe Ben really is just the man behind the curtain! Cannot wait until next season.
May 24th, 2007 at 3:08 am
I think the person in the casket is Locke. Jack feels guilty for taking them off the island for whatever reasons we haven’t seen yet, but also because the person who tried to keep them there is now dead off the island…just a theory….
Jack says in the end “He’s sick of lying.” Lying about what? Why was it a mistake to leave? This show is sooo good, but the questions are endless!
Also, I can’t believe Jack isn’t with Kate. I hope that resolves itself by the end of the series. They started the series together and they need to end it together as a couple.
Loved Matthew Fox’s performance…I think he was great
Also Charlie was wonderful
May 24th, 2007 at 3:16 am
“# Jennifer Says:
May 24th, 2007 at 1:59 am
Does anyone else continue to notice that only the Losties have killed anyone…The Others have not even still…..”
They killed Steve/Scott (or did Nikki or Paulo do it?), and Goodwin killed a taily and was going to kill Ana Lucia. They killed off all of the Tail section (except Bernard), or someone else did (other Others?). But then maybe these people are supposed to die to save the world.
May 24th, 2007 at 3:27 am
My crazy theory about the flash aheads to 5 years from now is based on the fact that the show’s clock runs in a way where one Island month equals one (yearly) season of Lost. Plus, It’s a time loop–it’s not just the pace of the show. This would mean that when the show actually has a real final episode in 2 (or is it 3) years, the rescued losties will learn that they were gone for roughly 5 years instead of 5 or 6 months.
The Losties biological ages will revert to real time when they leave the island, resulting in a rapid change of their appearance and biological ages. It would be like waking up and seeing a person in the mirror who is no long yourself,
Plus, it seems like the show is switching from flash-backs to flash-aheads … but are these flash aheads unchangeable?
May 24th, 2007 at 3:35 am
What an incredible show last night. Too much to truly, logically process with one viewing…which is why my wife and I are going to watch it again ASAP.
I believe that this show’s title has never been more appropriate than after last night’s episode. Jack is really ‘lost’…and I’ll bet that, as we see more of season 4 unfold, we will see just how ‘lost’ all the rest of the survivors are.
There is so many loose-ends to tie up within the next three seasons, that it could go any number of directions.
I will say that, for me, LOST is living up to its namesake…whether they’re on the island or not. (Don’t forget, we still have yet to learn of the outcomes of Locke, Richard Alpert and the rest of Ben’s former camp.)
What a rich season this has been.
Fantastic stuff and I look forward to January 2008. (And in the meantime may watch some of the earlier episodes again.)
May 24th, 2007 at 4:09 am
Wow! I was screaming at Charlie to just go out the freaking window…sad sad day. The writers really made me love his character again towards the end.
So was this our first flash forward? What a switch if Season 4 take place in “the real world” and the flashbacks are of events that happened on the island leading up to the losties departure/rescue.
“Others. Come in others!” Hurley was priceless, great to see him do something that re-establishes some self-esteem.
Ben is crazy and got beat by Jack. I was so pumped up, it was like watching a ROCKY movie!
The casket has to be a child’s because it was small. It doesn’t appear that Walt is that small anymore…LOL. Ben would make some sense but the coffin size still bothers me. Maybe it’s like post leg amputation for some reason. I don’t know they get back to the real world and his legs don’t work again and all the stress put on them while on the island has taken its toll?
Again great episode! Now the long wait for some answers.
Ciao
May 24th, 2007 at 4:10 am
First I think Locke is in the coffin. O’Quinn had recently stated in an interview (TV Guide online I believe) that he was not happy with the general direction of the show and I can imagine season 3 being Terry’s last. I haven’t heard whether or not Terry had signed on for season 4, but in terms how it all fit into the story, it seems to make the most sense. Why would any of the survivors want to pay their respects to Locke when he was the one that almost totally ruined the rescue? Locke’s death would probably affect Jack the most since Locke seemed to have an underlying communion with the island and Jack was probably thinking Locke was his best shot of getting back to the island. I can’t imagine Ben being in the casket because Jack had promised to kill Ben the moment they were being rescued.
I wouldn’t be surprised if the producers pull the rug out from under us at the opening of the next season and twist tonight’s finale into something completely different. I’m not one to totally discredit a possibility that what happened tonight might actually be the prelude to a distortion of time. It was only a few episodes ago when we found out that they found the airframe to Oceanic 815 completely in tact on the ocean floor and in fact everyone had died. I don’t think the survivors are dead, but tonight’s rescue of the survivors seemed too simple based on what we know the producers are capable of. Think about it in the final moments on the island, Locke turns away, let’s Jack make the call, and poof everyone is back living their lives in LA? Since when has anything with this show been so unambiguous and cut and dry? There is A LOT that still needs to be reconciled on this show before they can rescue our castaways. As cited in previous posts, what happened to the smoke monster, what’s the deal with Richard, and why haven’t we heard more about Jacob?
As a fan of Star Trek, I can see that maybe what we are witness to are slices of alternate realities. My guess is that there are still some decisions still to be made on the island and maybe even on the ride home back to LA where some of the Losties will have the opportunity to save Jack from the wretched life that we see him playing out tonight. Something happened either right before or as they were being rescued because why else would Jack plead with Kate, “No I’m sick… of lying.” What did they all lie about? What did they do during their rescue that makes Jack question their departure from the island? It’s going to be an interesting 3 seasons to see it wrap up.
Final thoughts. It dawned on me as I was watching this episode that Jack Shepard has actually become a burnt out Gregory House. He even picked up the habit of popping Oxy pills in almost every scene! Tonight’s Jack is a lot like House minus House’s wit, genius, and overall fire. Matthew Fox did a hell of a job tonight of portraying someone so broken and up able to pick up with life after going home.
Charlie’s death was true poetry and I loved his final movements of him making the sign of the Cross as he was awaiting his fate. Cyclops’s grin at the end was truly creepy and quite possibly the best closeup in the whole episode. “I didn’t want him to get you pregnant. I suppose I overreacted.” Hopefully this isn’t Michel Emerson’s final act because only he would be able to pull of a line with such seriousness, but still be able to bring a smile to my face when he said it. This episode was ridiculous just like this entry.
May 24th, 2007 at 4:11 am
A previous post mentioned that the losties returned to a different “world” then, which they left.
A couple points that support this idea are:
That Oceanic airlines are still in business and offering Golden tickets, if you remember back to the interactive games/ websites between seasons 2 and 3 the “official” Oceanic website stated since the disappearance of flight 815 all flights are cancelled and operations suspended.
The Christian Sheppard reference from Jack in the hospital
This could also explaine the difference between the 2 Desmond/Penny pictures. (Different worlds= slightly different content of pictures)
When Desmond turned the fail safe key it reset some sort of space-time continuum
Please add more occurrences that you have noticed!!!!
May 24th, 2007 at 4:11 am
Sorry I meant to say maybe its Locke post leg amputation.
May 24th, 2007 at 4:29 am
being that tom wasn’t shot in the head–maybe he isn’t dead.
i don’t know who is in the casket–i am not sure locke and ben would HAVE to leave the island–that is why locke is walking off.
May 24th, 2007 at 4:32 am
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May 24th, 2007 at 4:46 am
I agree with Bill that Locke would not leave the island unless forced to. Like Rousseau, who declared that she had nothing to go back to, Locke has found a purpose to his life ON the island that he could never find in the “real world.”
My theory about the person in the casket is that it’s Sawyer, simply because Kate’s reaction to the news of the death seemed a bit defensive. He and Jack were always at odds (so they were neither friends nor family) and he had no other friends or family of his own who might come to a viewing.
I love the idea that the woman who Jack rescued from the burning car was Cassie. I also wondered if it might be Juliette’s sister. Didn’t Cassie and Sawyer have a daughter, though? The kid who was pulled from the car was a boy. Maybe I’m remembering incorrectly.
May 24th, 2007 at 4:51 am
While I am not a time-loop fan either, five years in the future would explain how Walt got a lot older in a couple months!
Hurley’s rescue was not only a victory not only for him and Bernard, Jin, and Sayid (like you really believed they had shot them), but also for the redemptive nature of the island. No longer he is a harbinger of bad luck, but he is hero! An unlikely hero, perhaps, but he had face not only his fears and The Others but also being cruelly turned away by his friends, twice. It was one of the best moments of the season finale.
May 24th, 2007 at 5:28 am
After looking at the scene again, it does really seem like they made the casket smaller than a usual adult one. Being a Six Feet Under fan, I’m pretty sure that a funeral parlor would never use a smaller casket for an amputee. That’d just be weird. So I’m totally thinking it’s a kid now. Though, like someone pointed out, Walt’s getting pretty big. But I have always been a fan of the idea that, since he and Locke seem to have this tight connection with the powers of the island, they would both play major roles in the long-term story.
But it could definitely be a child we haven’t yet seen. My best guess at this point would be the child of Sawyer and Kate. But yeah, who knows. They’re going to be on that island for a while, I think, so anything could happen in between now and the departure of Jack and Kate. But I’m anti-Ben-in-the-coffin now.
I guess I’ll see what I think in
eight
long
long
terrible
long
months.
May 24th, 2007 at 5:34 am
Jack has some grey hairs in his beard on the island. If we truly did flash forward then he’s dying it. Kate and him were both disguised and met at night on the runway. Pretty secretive. What is the person in the casket was Kate’s kid that didnt make the “crossover” to real time and she left it somewhere for others to find. That would explain the ‘no friends or family’ thing. Anything from the island is sworn to secrecy.
And the funeral home “Hoffs Drawlar” is an anagram for “Flash Forward”.
Charlies not dead because Locke’s not dead.
May 24th, 2007 at 5:35 am
Jack has some grey hairs in his beard on the island. If we truly did flash forward then he’s dying it. Kate and him were both disguised and met at night on the runway. Pretty secretive. What if the person in the casket was Kate’s kid that didnt make the “crossover” to real time and she left the dead body somewhere for others to find. That would explain the ‘no friends or family’ thing. Anything from the island is sworn to secrecy.
And the funeral home “Hoffs Drawlar” is an anagram for “Flash Forward”.
Charlies not dead because Locke’s not dead.
May 24th, 2007 at 5:41 am
Danelle’s 16-year old distress message would have to be on tape — digital didn’t exist then. Service life of tape would deteriorate soon on a loop. Who built that tower and cool transmission facility? Where did the male voice in the distress transmission come from?
I would pay $50 to the person who could play Good Vibrations on a phone pad the first try (musician or not). I’ve been to a goat ropin’, two county fairs and all parts of Kentucky and I’ve never seen anything like that.
I just couldn’t get over Jack’s fake beard. I kept waiting for the mustache to peal away a little.
There were indeed some great moments in last night’s episode, but few, few answers. There are now SO MANY FRIGGIN’ QUESTIONS regarding this program, it’s pure mind-blow.
When it became evident that trying to film a long-term, high quality production in Hawaii was extremely difficult and costly, they should have wrapped it up. Moving the story to the mainland just to milk the story another 48-episodes is a mistake.
I just don’t know how you can have an intelligent conversation with someone about this program after last night. Face it.
May 24th, 2007 at 5:51 am
Ryan and Jen, I always enjoy reading your observations. Thanks for providing such a great place for Lost fans to discuss the show.
Well, I loved this episode. Matthew Fox was totally brilliant as a bearded, broken down, oxy-codone popping, suicidal version of Jack. Well done! I was surprised by the fact that this wasn’t a flashback…though I started to get suspicious when we saw maps all over Jack’s dishevelled house.
Maybe this wasn’t the future, though. Maybe everything we have been watching thus far has been a flashback and the bearded Jack and beautifully put together Kate are in the present? Hmmmm.
Who knows? Either way, I love the new twist. I admit, I was a bit ready for it when Carlton Cuse and Damon Lindelof (in the pre episode Lost primer) said in a very wink, wink, nudge, nudge sort of way, something to the effect of: “Well, if they were rescued there’d be no show”, which of course begs the question…”or would there?”
I realize I am probably in the minority here, but I would love a season of off Island, post-rescue Lost. I think so many questions could be answered and the Island would be an even more prominent player by looming large in it’s absence. I love Lost and have been watching it since the get go, but even I was begining to feel that the show was running the risk of becoming a bit absurd if some of the Island issues weren’t resolved soon. So, it’s kind of brilliant to resolve the most obvious Island issue of all, the rescue, and now focus on the really fun and creepy Island issues, but from a different perspective.
Also, Jack talks about going back to “help them” at the end of the finale, so we have to assume that maybe not everyone got rescued, which opens up a whole new can of worms. So, maybe a season of episodes about the rescued and those who remain on the Island would satisfy the strict Islandists.
Who was in the casket? I thought maybe Sawyer…but Ben makes more sense, still, Jack ran his hand over the casket in a loving sort of way that makes me think…not Ben…Locke? As far as I could tell the head line of the newspaper bit read: “Man found dead…” No big surprise there.
Why did bearded Jack keep refering to his father? At first I assumed this was just drug addled confusion, but, now…well the whole game has changed.
Naomi is bad. I always thought she was kind of iffy. Does she work for Penny’s Dad…somehow there is a Desmond connection.
Some of my favorite bits:
-Rouseau to Alex, in a kindly, motherly sort of way: “help me tie him up”, refering to Ben. Yikes. I can’t help but wonder if poor Alex is going out of the pot and into the frying pan with her new mom.
-Mikhail holding the hand grenade outside the window was possibly the creepiest shot off all season. What a freak that guy is.
-Ben losing his credibility with pretty much everyone.
-”I know, I know, I am a dentist, not Rambo”- Bernard
-Hurley’s dramatic save and the look on Juliet’s face when Sawyer shot “Mr. Friendly”..a perfect mixture of horror and relief.
May 24th, 2007 at 6:19 am
Wow! What a great episode! Although I had read some spoilers, I watched and was truly entertained. M. Fox did such an awsome job portraying himself as “lost” in his return. I think that by the way the Dr. and nurses looked at him when he said they should call his father down and see who was drunker was just him being wasted/high/hopeless. And that his fathewr is really dead. The entire main cast was awsome, loved the part with Rose saying she was going to punch Jack if he told her the live together die alone bit. Just something I thought of hadn’t Rose and
Bernard decided they were going to stay on the Island, didn’t she have cancer or something and since they were on the Island she seemed to have been healed like everyone else? Will the next few seasons be filled with flashes forward instead of back or will we see past,present and future? Wow! I hope we don’t see Cyclops again, he reslly creeps me out! I’m going to watch the episode again, and check back later to see any new ideas on who was in the casket, it seemed like Jack was surprised that there hadn’t been anyone else, obviously it was not some one well liked by Kates reaction to the newsclipping/obit. Maybe it’s someone we don’t even know of yet. The Lady Jack pulls from the burning car, I think that will be someone connected to someone either Julliette’s sister or another survivor somehow. I actually find myself missing Chuck!
May 24th, 2007 at 7:02 am
Some items of interest. Folks on lost-forum.com have done hi-res screencaps of the item Jack tore from the paper. They were able to make out:
“Man found… downtown LA. The body of J________ __antham of New York was found shortly after 4am in the ________ of Grand Avenue. (Missing) ____ham at The (missing) ___ard loud (missing) ___gan’s loft. (missing) _afety, her (missing) _overed the… (missing) …a beam in the…”
Secondly, the coffin was definitely not a full, adult size coffin. It was 5 feet long at most.
Third, regarding filming next year, Kristin posed a series of statements to Damon Lindelof to which he commented. Here is one:
Kristin - You are shooting in Hawaii next season.
Lindelof - Yes. Mostly.
So it seems we’re not done with the action on the island, by far.
John
May 24th, 2007 at 8:15 am
Everything is speculation now until Season #4 begins, right? Were they ALL rescued? How far into the future were we with Jack? Who was in the casket? Is Christian Shephard still alive? Are we sure Charlie drowns? He said he could hold is breath for several minutes, maybe that room fills up and he’s able to escape out the hole made my the grenade. Long shot perhaps, but anything is possible. I’m not convinced that Season #4 will begin off the island; there are a lot of answers left hanging for us on the island. The smoke monster et al. I am in for the long haul. I don’t need instant gratification. I have faith the producers/writers have a true vision for this show, and I am satisfied to watch it all unfold all in due time. We were led to believe that if they get off the island the show ends, right? How clever to show us that is not the case. I am sure there will be flashbacks to the island, to the past before the island, and now even into the future. Heck, maybe Jack is in a magic room on the island with Ben showing him what life would be like if they left the island - It’s A Wonderful Life. Who knows? Only the fantastic creators of LOST. So we are left to wait until 2008. In the meantime, we all need to send good vibes out in the world and hope that the powers that be recognize LOST, and it’s wonderful creators/directors/writers and extremely talented actors come all the award nominations. This show deserves so many accolades!! Bravo one and all. THE BEST SHOW ON TV - EVER!
May 24th, 2007 at 8:20 am
WOW!
Bill- ok… to start off… you always post on the site and I get a kick out of most of your posts, but we have 8 long months to go before we get some new LOST fixes…. are we really gonna start picking apart the episode and telling everyone how “fakey” stuff looks and how dumb we think evrything was? pick all you want…I think it rocked… and plan to enjoy every last second of it over and over… nuff said. Do I think Charlie coulda got out and locked the door before Old One-Eyed Freak-o pulled the pin? Hell yeah! But it didn’t happen that way, so what can we do? I have faith in the writers… they have rocked my world for 3 years already, and If I thought I could do better, I’d have been hounding the producers to join the team myself! (Although that would be awesome…) Anyway I am curious about the obituary, but I can wait to see who it really turns out to be. I want a Danielle Flashback so bad, it hurts! I think she is just the coolest! I want to see more Alex… less Jack… more about the 4 toed statue and this ‘temple’ Cap’n Bunny-Killer spoke of…more of the Ageless Wonder, Richard and his merry band of Duncan McCleod-esque immortal buddies like Patchy. We’ll see!
May 24th, 2007 at 8:36 am
I’m starting to think that Jack probably lied about leaving some people behind on the island. That’s what he can’t bear to live with and it’s the reason why he is so desperate to go back to the island at the end of the finale. It makes sense to me now, however I am not the one to take credit for this idea. I came across this on some other forum postings, but it’s the theory I can get most behind until season 4 begins some 8 months from now.
May 24th, 2007 at 8:37 am
One thing that really bothered me was not the fact that Charlie died but the illogical way they had him die. He’s in this communications room. He sees Mickeal outside the porthole with a grenade. He sees Desmond running towards the door. Quickly Charlie slams the door, the grenade explodes flooding the room and killing himself.
Let me ask you, why not run out the door, close it behind you and save yourself? The grenade pin was already pulled and it would have exploded and simply flooded the room.
It simply made no logical sense.
May 24th, 2007 at 8:43 am
I think Penny was in her dad’s office when she was contacting the Looking Glass station.
May 24th, 2007 at 8:51 am
this season just got stronger and better and returned to greatness. on a guilty pleasure note, i just loved the back and forth between Juliette and Sawyer in this ep.
May 24th, 2007 at 9:08 am
It may be Ben’s funeral, but was he really in the casket since Jack was asked if he wanted to see the body and he declined. The dead never really seem to stay dead in this show.
May 24th, 2007 at 9:12 am
# Daren Says:
May 24th, 2007 at 4:11 am
A previous post mentioned that the losties returned to a different “world” then, which they left.
A couple points that support this idea are:
That Oceanic airlines are still in business and offering Golden tickets, if you remember back to the interactive games/ websites between seasons 2 and 3 the “official” Oceanic website stated since the disappearance of flight 815 all flights are cancelled and operations suspended.
The Christian Sheppard reference from Jack in the hospital
This could also explaine the difference between the 2 Desmond/Penny pictures. (Different worlds= slightly different content of pictures)
When Desmond turned the fail safe key it reset some sort of space-time continuum
Please add more occurrences that you have noticed!!!!
Here’s one, Charlie couldn’t swim, then he could.
May 24th, 2007 at 9:13 am
Looking at a screen cap of Jack’s hand on the casket and measuring the width of his partially outstretched hand, which on a man is between 6-7 inches, the casket in the scene has an outside dimension of between 57 and 66 inches or about 5 to 5.5 feet. The interior dimension would be considerably smaller. Even stretching the casket length to an outside length of 72 inches or 6 feet, the interior would be somewhere around 5 feet in length.
Locke (Terry O’Quinn) is 6′2″ I believe. He wouldn’t fit. Ben (Michael Emerson) is 5′9. He wouldn’t fit. Whoever is in this coffin is pretty short or else they just used a really small casket!
May 24th, 2007 at 9:16 am
When we first discovered The Others did not shoot Bernard, Jin & Sayid, Ben’s buddy said something to the effect of “Ben’s lost it. We should have kill them instead of shooting into the sand”. Implying, Ben instructed them to fake their deaths to envoke something from Jack as a last result. If this is true, Ben never inteaded on killing them.
Seemed relativant to his argument that they’re the good guys.
May 24th, 2007 at 9:17 am
In response to John Fischer:
In an article posted on TVGuide.com they said that Charlie slammed the door so that Des wouldn’t save him this time. He chose to sacrifice himself so that his prediction from the episode before about him drowning and Claire and Aaron, as well as the rest of the group, all being rescued by helicopter. So while it looked illogical because he could have shut the door behind him or swam out the broken window, not to mention how long it would have taken that room to fill with water even if he had not shut the door. He didn’t want to be rescued this time, he wanted the precognition to play out.
May 24th, 2007 at 9:40 am
JBud,
Thanks for the insight. That comment during the episode bothered me, but not it makes a lot more sense. I think the others are both better and worse than we think they are. They are capable of terribly acts in the name of a greater good we just can’t see, yet.
Does anyone know if there is going to be another Lost “experience” this summer?
May 24th, 2007 at 9:40 am
It is interesting to think that the rest of Lost may be devoted to the entire cast, in the future, trying to get back to the island instead of being in the past trying to get off of the island. What an interesting way to finish off the rest of the series!
May 24th, 2007 at 9:50 am
Gabe-Thanks for the reply. My point was that no one recognized Jack as a member of a famous and tragic airline accident as I suppose they all would have been upon returning to civilization. So either 1) He was in disguise and therefore unrecognizable 2) The crash was being kept secret for some reason or 3) the return of the survivors was being kept secret for some reason.
May 24th, 2007 at 9:56 am
I am at work now and can’t read all the responses (will do when I get home tonight) so sorry if this has already been tossed out there.
I thought it remarkable that Charlie was able to get the musical code right on the very first try. For one thing, it was a numeric key pad and not a keyboard. Even as a musician I would think that knowing the intervals and tones for each numbered key would take some trial and error. Also, how did he know which part of the song was used as the code? My speculation is that Charlie is the one who actually coded the pad the first time in another timeline.
My brain hurts! Gotta go back to work…
May 24th, 2007 at 10:01 am
Just a quick note about Jen’s question about the six episode pod that started the season. I think that it only existed that way because the powers that be at ABC required LOST to hit all the sweeps weeks. What made them back of that in the future seasons is probably because of the audience backlash.
May 24th, 2007 at 10:02 am
Just something that I missed. What did the Dr. say the name was of the woman Jack saved, when they were talking just after Jack stole the pills?
And did any anyone catch the name of the guy that answered the phone when Jack made the call off the Island? Does it mean anything?
May 24th, 2007 at 10:09 am
Well all my theories from last week got blown out of the water, but that won’t stop me from putting forward new theories.
I think Ben is in the coffin for the following reasons: 1) Jack doesn’t consider himself a friend, which I think he would with the others Losties. However, I can imagine Jack going to pay respects to Ben. 2) The person didn’t have any family. Ben lost his parents and doesn’t have any siblings. 3) The person must be destitute to be in a shabby funeral home in that part of town. Ben probably didn’t have much of a pension from Dharma.
Lastly, what were Jack’s first words when he made the phone call from the bridge? I thought he said “Annie”, but I suppose he could have said “It’s me”. If he said “Annie”, then it would make sense that the article was about Ben.
Any screen shots of the maps on Jack’s wall? Is he looking for the island? Could the island still somehow be invisible to the outside world?
May 24th, 2007 at 10:35 am
There’s no use trying to twist the “just shoot the sand” order from Ben into making him a good guy. He probably did it just so he could reuse the hostages later? He ordered his men to kill anyone that tried to stop them from kidnapping the camp’s women for god’s sake!
May 24th, 2007 at 10:54 am
I just wanted to say a quick thanks for sharing so many detailed insights. I enjoy reading the posts every week even though I haven’t yet posted myself. I consider myself to be a reasonably intelligent woman, but some of you are waaay too smart and observant. Sometimes if takes me days to digest an episode, and I know I drive my fiance nuts!
I noticed something last night that could be insignificant, but we all the the writers don’t place too many details by accident these days, esp knowing that viewers eventually will notice eVErything. When Jack’s ex-wife came to the hospital as the official “next-of-kin”, did anyone else notice that she was pregnant? I found it curious that he didn’t comment on her condition, and I wonder if the visual was just meant to be just an additional kick-in-the gutt for him. Why would it have been “inappropriate” for her to take him home from the hospital? Awkward, maybe, but why come down to the hospital at all? If Jack and gang were offically declared dead from the plane crash but then found alive, wouldn’t that have cleared up the next-of-kin issue when Jack first “died”? Again, maybe it’s nothing.
One other revelation that I hope is explored next season, yet rarely commented upon…Claire is Jack’s half-sister, which makes Aaron Jack’s half-nephew. Can we also assume that Paolo and Nikki are dead by now? I’m still not sure if they had a point after all.
It will be a long eight months!
May 24th, 2007 at 11:45 am
What is this temple that Ben is talking about?
What about the 4 toe’d statue along the river bank?
May 24th, 2007 at 12:23 pm
“What if everything we saw on the island tonight, the trek to the radio tower and Locke’s return and the disabling of the Looking Glass and the call to the freighter — what if that was the flashback, that was the stuff bearded Jack was remembering?” interesting thought from Zap2it.com… just makes you think… whoa…
May 24th, 2007 at 1:01 pm
Awesome finale. I sort of had a feeling from the begining that this was happening after they got off the island. The paper and the funeral was bugging me through the whole episode, but I’m glad that they didn’t reveal who it was. the speculation will deffinitly keep me occupied until next season. One thing that I did notice was that the coffin was kind of small, so I was thinking that it was a child. I don’t think that it was Aaron or Walty because I’m sure that the survivors would turn out for either of their funerals.
As for Christian, there are a myriad of explinations for that that I’m sure will be explored thouroghly by Theory Mongers over the break. I can’t wait to see what people come up with.
May 24th, 2007 at 1:07 pm
My take on the future bearded Jack and Kate is that Jack regrets that he didn’t wind up with Kate. The “he’ll be back home soon” person is probably Sawyer–It’s just my gut feeling. It seems that Kate has never gotten over the site of Jack and Juliette exchanging a passionate kiss. Heck, Jack was able to get over the site of Sawyer and Kate together in the cage. In the season finale, Jack told Kate that he loves her (without any response from Kate). Jack just wants to be with Kate and he sees going back to the Island as the only way to recapture the opportunity to mate with Kate
… plus, he realizes that he was happier on the Island than he ever was or will be back home.
May 24th, 2007 at 1:28 pm
Don’t forget one of the women in the looking glass told charlie part of the code already…..though she did speak it a bit fast…..and if you have a musical ear and remember those numbers…just fill in the blanks…and i guess that was how he knew where to start…where to end though…i don’t know.
And seriously Patchy gave me a nightmare last night. That smirk just *shiver*….
May 24th, 2007 at 2:06 pm
Theory 1 – Sawyers funeral? Not many people would show up for a con man. Also justifies Jack’s answer that he was neither friend nor family.
Theory 2 – Why can’t Jack & Kate be together in the future? Was a deal struck to get off the island with who ever was expecting Kate at home?
Theory 3 – There is no more reasons for back stories. We know they get rescued. Will we now see what happens to everyone after rescue with the final episode being the rescue?
May 24th, 2007 at 2:49 pm
That scene with Jacks ex bothered me a little, obviously she knew he wasn’t handling the return home very well when she asked him wether he was drinking again.I understand if she had concern for him, but if she wasn’t willing to help than she should have just stayed out of the room. At least get the guy a cab!
May 24th, 2007 at 3:29 pm
I thought that the funeral was for Kate’s Mom.That would be a way for Jack to see Kate again.The way Kate’s Mom told her to never come around again would explain Kate saying at the end “Why would I go to the funeral?”
Was Sawyer struggling with his killing Locke’s father in cold blood? He was over it when it came time to deal with big Tom.That was one of the best lines of the season…”That’s for taking the kid off the boat.”
May 24th, 2007 at 5:00 pm
It’s interesting that the funeral home was in such a low income area. They went to great lengths to show African-Americans (group out front, funeral director) but I don’t think it foretells Walt since their lifestyle was certainly not low income prior to the crash. I think it’s a red herring.
I also noticed the new Motorola KRZR (tm, ?) phone and thought those weren’t around in 2004 or earlier. The producers have been too careful or they’ve been cute about prop placement (washing machines) to overlook something so obvious.
The episode was beautiful in its ambiguity and mystery while still being satisfying. That to me was the real artistry of the episode. How to reveal enough to leave us fulfilled but clever enough to keep us guessing. BRAVO!
May 24th, 2007 at 5:49 pm
I think Season 3 has to be the strongest season of Lost yet. It did take a while to start up, and there were a few clunkers (Stranger in a Strangelenad), and questionable decisions by the Producers (Nikki & Paulo), but as Evangeline put it in her Jimmy Kimmel Live interview, this was the most satisfying and juicy reveal that we have had on the show yet.
And Kudos especially to all the actors for their brilliant work. Matthew Fox was so convincing as the despondent Jack, that I knew right off the bat we were seeing a changed Jack of the future.
One more thought….even if we were shown the name in the newspaper clipping (which appear to be a J. Wrentham) whose to say the name is not an alias….maybe someone from the Island was placed in WPP?
May 24th, 2007 at 5:58 pm
@ Connie from Alaska
“I thought it remarkable that Charlie was able to get the musical code right on the very first try. ”
Bonnie mentioned before dying that the machine had been built by a musician. IF we are to believe the theory that the Losties are living in a time loop, then who’s to say that in one of these loops, the Losties become the others, and Charlie is the one who builds the machine. That would explain how he knew to play the code so easily.
May 24th, 2007 at 7:44 pm
I think that the next season is going to be centered on “The Temple.”
Charlie was able to work out the code on the first try because he had the first number, 5–he even wrote it down, right? He just couldn’t remember all the rest of the numbers until he was told what the melody was, and he worked it out from there.
I have never been a “talk to the TV while I watch” person, but I was talking/hollering constantly last night. Good thing my daughter was doing it too and we were the only ones watching in the house.
May 24th, 2007 at 9:19 pm
Other possible people in the casket:
Claire (if Jack didn’t know they were related)
Rose (she died of cancer)
Richard Alpert (he lost his immortality after he left the Island)
Julliet (she could have left Jack after she left the island.. so was neither friend nor relative)
Patchy (he lost his immortality after he left the island)
Vincent (he was almost human.. woof woof)
Bernard (he lost Rose, and died from lonliness)
Ben (except Jack vowed to kill Ben just before they left the Island)
Sayid (could have turned on Jack after leaving the island)
Desmond (I don’t think him and Jack were really best buds)
So….
I’m going to pick Locke as the most likely casket dweller
May 24th, 2007 at 9:25 pm
I heard someone suggest this theory.. maybe everytime Desmond “saved” Charlie, he not only affected the future, but also the past.
Think about it. If Desmond had let Charlie get killed by lightening (the first Time Loop :-), they might never have gotten off the island, Jack’s father would still be dead, and so on
May 24th, 2007 at 10:13 pm
I can’t imagine a funeral for a child where no one showed up…no parent, grandparent, state appointed guardian, institution director or even a doctor. For that reason, even though the casket is small, I don’t think it is a kid.
However, if one of the Others who had been on the Island for a long time (like Richard Alpert) were returned to civilization, maybe his body would rapidly age. Very old people tend to shrink and wither, so maybe the casket holds the shriveled dried up husk of someone like Ben or Richard or maybe even Jacob.
May 25th, 2007 at 3:44 am
The casket could contain anyone. I even thought of Old Man Whidmore, the richest, most powerful person in this saga reduced to nothingness.
Too bad it didn’t contain Jack’s wife, Sarah. Jack restored her ability to walk (with help, I suspect, from Mittlelos) married her, worked his butt off and she treats him like dirt. Won’t even give him a ride home. He KISSED another woman, but shamefully admitted it. There has to be more to their story or she is a just One Stone-Cold Super B.
I posted earlier that Charlie could have never nailed Good Vibrations on the number keypad. That song even has several movements / melodies — which melody do you choose to key-in? One mistake and you have to start over. BS - but makes a good drama and we’ll always love Brian, Carl, Dennis, Al and Mike.
I’m not sure Patchy could have blown the hatch port hole with a hand grenade. The explosion would have radiated in all directions and not just toward the glass. The water pressure would also supress the blast and that looked like a heavy duty facility. Since we didn’t see any blood or body parts rush into the communications room following the explosion — Patchy Lives to cause more mischief and mayhem.
Cheers for Patchy’s makeup!!!!!!; Jeers for Jack’s beard. I don’t care what you say Connie in Alaska, his beard would have looked more realistic drawn on with a magic marker.
I remember (way back) they found a glass eyeball in the Arrow Hatch and I assumed it was Mikhal’s. I assumed wrong.
May 25th, 2007 at 4:52 am
Hey there everyone, just wondering if there is anything known about the “Temple” that the others are on their way to. Is it the Toed statue remanent? Also did anyone get a look at the book that Ben was writting in just before Bonnie called him on the Walkie? Just curious what he was writting.
May 25th, 2007 at 5:33 am
One more observation.
Did you notice the Dharma sign on the looking glass station. It was a rabbit! Alice in Wonderland strikes again!
May 25th, 2007 at 7:09 am
In the late 20s and into the 30s, rabbits were used to determine PREGNANCY. Female urine was injected into the rabbit and observations were made. The term “the rabbit died” meant a positive pregnancy (although it didn’t necessarily kill the rabbit). Alex was skinning a rabbit for food at the camp. Ben digs them.
People who would resist leaving the island: Locke, Kate, Rose, Bernard, Ben. Not sure about Richard, Mikhal or that Jacob guy.
the Temple sounds fascinating. See “you all” in 2008.
May 25th, 2007 at 9:27 am
If Alex was is the daughter of Ben and Rousso, then Rousso then how come Rousso isn’t dead from giving birth unless she was off the island when she concieved (with ben). She must have been on the island during birth if she recorded that message three days before Alex was born. And for that matter who helped her give birth if she was “all alone” like she said in her broadcast?
May 25th, 2007 at 9:32 am
My first thought was that the funeral was for locke, and that fits really well with the theme of the show “should have never left” and with Kate’s reaction…..The only problem is that I don’t believe Locke would ever leave the island unless they were all forced somehow.
May 25th, 2007 at 9:45 am
Before I post one of my never ending posts I’m still working through everything …thank God I have 8 months…sweet.
Question : I thought Jack told the funeral director “Either” when asked if the person was friend or family…I replayed it several times…did anyone else hear this?
May 25th, 2007 at 9:58 am
Has anyone else noticed that Charlie and Desmond could have just chopped the elctric cable on the beach in two pieces and saved everyone the trouble? Not very dramatic I know but logical in the least…..and hooray for Hurley….and Walt had a little growth spurt between apparitions. Maybe Michael and Walt can come save everyone from the evil freighter with his mystical powers….
May 25th, 2007 at 10:32 am
Bill-I had the same reaction as you regarding Charlie and the musical keypad. He just walked right up to it and punched in the code, complete with little bouncy grace notes thrown in. That song has more than one motif, how did he know which one to use? The best explanation is that he is the one who programmed it in the first place.
May 25th, 2007 at 10:42 am
Bill Says:
May 24th, 2007 at 5:41 am
I just don’t know how you can have an intelligent conversation with someone about this program after last night. Face it.
I agree - - I’m trying to get a few friends who have not watched caught up - - I find myself holding back from explaining things so I don’t spoil it…but I’m not so sure I could spoil anything in a logical way….it’s the fun I guess. I’ve got other friends who don’t plan to start watching….and it’s just as impossible to even explain what the heck it is “about”…..their loss….
Question : I thought Jack told the funeral director “Either” when asked if the person was friend or family…I replayed it several times…did anyone else hear this?
May 25th, 2007 at 1:48 pm
Bill–I replayed the funeral parlor scene again and you’re right. Jack’s response to the funeral directed is “Either” which begs the question again of who could it be? ,,, who would be both a friend and a relative that no one (not even Kate) would care about (except for Jack). The only person that I can think of is Jack’s half-sister (Claire).
May 25th, 2007 at 3:52 pm
I heard either as well
May 25th, 2007 at 10:35 pm
Is it possible to watch the scene again with the closed captioning turned on?
May 26th, 2007 at 1:18 am
What a memorable finale… my wife was in the early stages of labor as we watched from the hospital! The docs and nurses were kind enough to not interrupt much.
And now we have a beautiful baby girl.
If it weren’t for the sheer ecstasy, I might be having bigger withdrawal. I somehow got sucked into a 45 minute post last night (”Are you writing on that Lost web site?” asks my wife) that DIDN’T GO THROUGH. Ugh.
Anyway, a few thoughts:
- How can a hand grenade go off underwater? Doesn’t the gunpowder or immolative agent get sodden?
- I think the Jack shout-outs to Christian were intentional… he was drugged up, but I do think he knew his dad was dead. Defiant, stubborn Jack does not care. It also preserves the dramaticc onceit until the big reveal at the end.
- In the coffin? No idea. Maybe Jacob? Seems to me like it’s clearly someone everyone else was ok leaving behind. Maybe the newspaper article/obit was planted as a means of trying to call people together?
- Bummed Tom was killed. But aside from him and Charlie those deaths hardly sent a ripple in the water of the Lost landscape. (And I’m ok with that.)
- At first I thought the Hurley van episode was useless feel-good puff. Now we know it’s where Ben murdered his dad, touched off the purge, and where Hurley killed Ryan to save the day. Makes a lot more sense in retrospect.
- This episode gave some fuel to the time loop theories, but never in a million years did it cross my mind that Charlie would have somehow programmed the sequence to be Good Vibrations and remembered how to play it but not the code or where the switch was. I’m sorry to whoever posted but MAN is that a stretch.
- The person above who said months = weeks on the island… cool thought. There’s some kind of science behind this that I vaguely remember, but not a “time loop.” Time slows down as you approach the speed of light via Einstein’s relativity theory (I think). So if you could travel at the speed to light (which would be a bumpy ride, as they keep calling it), when you returned you would have barely aged while the people you left behind would have done so greatly.
- Not sure at all how Kate is no longer a fugitive… although she could be (they never say she’s not and her OGM does not identify her by name).
- I like the idea that Charles Widmore may also be looking for Desmond and Naomi may be with him.
- Lastly… I had a feeling we’d see a paradigm shift this episode (I posted here before about how each season finale seems to do this) and I wonder if now that we have a finite endpoint, if they wil completely dismiss with the flashbacks and only do flash forwards. That would save us the “Bernard learns how to do a root canal” or “Claire listens to Morrissey for the first time” episodes. It would also provide a semblance of symmetry. I have to believe that much of the action will remain on the island (there’s too much story left to tell) but now it will be a question of how they get from middle to end, rather than from beginning to middle. I think if they have left the island and it’s all about picking up the pieces (which interestingly Kate was doing ok with and Jack was obviously not) that they’ll lose a lot of viewers.
THAT being said, last season ended in a snowstorm, and the last time we saw that was, well, never again. So the flash forward may have all been a distraction.
May 26th, 2007 at 1:28 am
Oh, one final thought…
To me, a SPOILER is someone posting a few weeks ago saying, “these people are going to die by season’s end.” A post on here after someone has seen Lost on EDT before it airs PDT is NOT a spoiler.
If it’s a matter of hours, I think it’s ok to post. If it’s something that is not common knowledge, links are ok with a warning that spoilers follow.
So no fair posting about the Zombie Season in season 7.
May 26th, 2007 at 6:09 am
Dave-congrats on the birth of your baby girl … as far as grenades, I found some info in Wilkpedia on how they can explode under water:
“Although leaving a grenade in water for hours may hinder its exploding capabilities, priming a grenade … Because of this, an AN-M14 can burn underwater. …”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hand_grenade
http://www.answers.com/topic/hand-grenade-2
May 26th, 2007 at 6:59 am
I totally know it was a flash forward when Jack was in his room with maps all around him. I then knew he was calling Kate!!! I was telling my husband then and there that “That’s the future huns!!! After they’re rescued!!!”. It was an amazing episode. I have come to believe also the following:
1) The Hostiles, the original people of the island were probably living in this “special” island like how Adam and Eve were before the temptaion incident. Naked, enjoying the gifts of the island, until Dharma came to exloit it and call it their own.
2) Ever since then, they have been trying to get their island back.
3) Ben, a def