Juliet is obv David’s mother…

I’m thinking Locke’s wedding will bring them all together. Locke will get hurt saving pops from Sawyer and end up in the ER, where Juliet will be tending ER. She will summon Jack per his specialty. Claire will be in the pic as per Jacks mother asking if he heard of her. Christian’s will, will identify her possibly. I also think Jack is related to more than just Claire. Don’t have my notes here for this…

Could OG Locke become a resurrection?! Would be interesting?

Christian could very well be on the sub. With his body missing yet again. Possibly on the sub via Wmore? Where else could his body realistically be? This also would obv go with Shepard’s house on the lighthouse mirror, and Jack was merely a tool to bring Christian. Same with Claire. The tnt did not go off because Jack thought he was special imo. This is why Rico looked so surprised. Both theorys have the lost curve ball. Also if it worked as Juliet supposedly claimed, and Jack is in LA but another Shepard is still missing, could be Christian was the replacement and he is still on the island?

I also had a thought about people born on the island in the sideways… are they the only ones we have seen interacting with O6 in LA? Miles, Alex, Ginger? I don’t remember atm…

/ramble i’ll come back later more prepared sorries excellent podcast bummed I just found it. Keep up the great work!

@Montreal LAFLEUR I too have thought Richard could have been a prisoner. The Black Rock could have been bringing prisoners to Australia. Australia is the key to the game after all! Flocke said he was bound to the island. Could he mean that both figuratively and literally? When he is Smoky he sounds like he is spinning out on a chain from a winch.

FLocke working on Kate – It seemed odd to me that he felt he had to point out “Hydra” island for Kate. She knows what it is. Was that a bit of exposition for the viewers? You would think that if he has been there for hundreds of years that the island might have had another name before the DI built a station there. Also he said, I know how you feel, just like Ben said to Ilana, hmm

Widmore’s sub team – Oxford??

@ Rey Maybe Miles is Sawyer’s constant?

I want to read all of your great comments and theories if there is time before tomorrow! I can’t wait for 609!

I can’t wait for tomorrow’s episode!!!!

Eloise tells Jack that Locke is a substitute, for Christian who was MIB on the island and Jack puts his dad’s shoes on Locke before he flies back on 316. Sure makes sense now.

Jack’s grandfather’s eyes are looking mighty dark at times, they make it clear that he has left his nursing home 4x and he does not tell Jack where he has been.

Seems to me that Jack is being made to think he finds his father’s shoes by accident but is defiantly being manipulated by his grandfather who seems to know more than he is letting on.

Cut to Kate looking very zombie like, Jack’s granddad did something to her.

Hurley buys out all of the rest of the seats in true “good guy” fashion.

re-watching is so much fun

L O S T should be held up to its own standards and not by what TV has to offer. Let’s not lower our expectations folks. As I said in one of my earlier posts regarding the first few episodes, S6 is reminding me of the turn Lost took for the worst back in episodes 2/3 where there was too much filler and too little resolution. The plot seems to be widening but at the same time becoming dangerously thin. Not saying there haven’t been any HFC moments, but they seem to be far and in between.

I heard one of the cast members comment about people “nit-picking” over every detail. LOST has always been about the details. So to expect fans to somehow let things go unanswered seems a bit unrealistic after five years of detail driven story lines.

Lost University might be on to something

If I only did this much homework while I was in school….

1 day, 45 hours 2741, minutes and 164481 seconds until Ab Aeterno!!!!!

I do see (someone’s) point in the fact that we will not get answers to small things….my only problem is that I wish maybe they would have explained some things as they were going along. Or would that have given over things away? I guess my point is that while some things are definitely insignificant, it is hard to know with this show, where every detail seems to count!

Theorizing about who’s good/bad and everything is definitely awesome, but with this present material, I feel slightly overwhelmed so I am just kind of watching and letting it all sink in before I formulate an opinion.

Other posters asked these two questions earlier, and I thought that they were valid questions–they just got overlooked:

1.How did the Black Rock get in the middle of the island. Is that due to the island itself moving?

2. What exactly were those immunizations for that Desmond got and Claire later? To keep from going to the dark side? The person that asked this question also thought that this is why Claire and Sayid are acting so differently–claire got the shots and sayid did not. I dunno, thought it was interesting.

I know Im beginning to ramble, but I’m trying to keep my patience with this show: maybe I am alone in this feeling, but there is PLENTLY to answer from prior seasons. I guess it just bothers me that I know most of these things will remain a question.

Seiously… EXPLAIN DI in all this! That does not seem like too much to ask for.

@Corivee- I think what you said about smokey’s early connection to Locke has given me something to think about. You have some good ideas that make sense.

I still have the sense that there was a time loop and several of these things happened before and they happen again till the results are the changes that need to happen.

@shannymac- Thanks for the countdown!! It’s going to be a great episode with some important reveals, I can just feel it.

Sorry for triple posting.

Perhaps Widmore’s plan is to allow Sawyer and his friends to get on the sub and think they are getting away… only to remotely set off an explosion once they are a safe distance from his island. He pretty much proved with the freighter that he doesn’t really care who dies as long as he wins.

Locke was special and connected to the island since childhood. Richard visits Locke as a young boy and little Locke had a drawing of a smoke monster and a person screaming. Richard gave him a comic book, a rusty knife, a vile of sand and compass. Richard asks Locke if any of the items belonged to him. So you see Locke already had “memories” of the island and connections to smokey. I think this is significant and shows Locke’s destiny. Like Locke was reincarnated and has past memories or something. Richard ends up leaving but later visits Locke again in high school. I think Richard was checking on him for Jacob to see if he was ready OR this theory:

Maybe using Locke as the loophole happened earlier than we realize. Maybe the transfer started when Locke was a kid and MIB could only completely consume Locke after he died. This would explain his island and smokey knowledge at a young age.

What do you think?

I bet Jack’s grandfather was there in the 50′s in the war, the age works out. Remember the soldiers that left Jughead?

* Sawyer wants a sub – perhaps the dharmaville sub.
1. He was at the jetty just a few eps ago
2. The Widmore sub seems too ambitious a challenge
3. Back when the dharma sub was blown, there was a theory going that perhaps Locke just made it look blown. Perhaps Its either still there, or slightly moved – thoughts?

RANT on the theme of PARENTAL ISSUES
**
I really really really REALLY hope that the theme of parental issues becomes a key in the show’s
eventual end. With ManInBlack’s talk of having a crazy mother, and the infertility on the island,
I can really see the mythological side of the show attempting to provide some insight,
a particular resolute perspective, on not only the impact of parentals upon our losties lives,
but also how they are meant to deal with it. (Sawyer killing Locke’s dad – perhaps not the finest point made =P )
**

keep it up guys

How does Charlie’s death on-island fit into the flashsideways stuff? And what about Boone? will we see him again? I’m thinking not next week since it’s a Richard Alpert episode (yippee!) But perhaps after that? And will we see what happened to Jin, since he was last seen in a freezer with Sayid?

Is the sailboat Elizabeth still anchored somewhere?
There could be a flurry of people locked in the sub: Desmond, Penny, Charlie, Faraday, Hawking, and (why not) Ji Yon and Aaron
So are Jack and James starting a new generation of MIB vs Jacob ? or are new recruits already being considered for the following generation ?

As you can read, I am better with questions than answers…
Still, what a delight to read about comments from people all over the world (Slovenia really? thats great)

I thought it was a good episode although not as great as the previous 2. I’ve been reading through the comments on here and dont know if anyone has picked up on the book that was beneath ‘watership down’ on Sawyers bedside table in the flash sideways (appologies if its already been mentioned!!).

The book is called ‘a wrinkle in time’ by Madeleine L’Engle, and a brief summary of the plot says its about a girl whos father disappears. He is a scientist who was researing a phenomenon called tesseract which is said to be folding the fabric of space and time. The girl is to a utopian planet (sounds a bit like the island) which is under attack from an evil being who appears as a “large dark cloud called the “black thing” which sounds an awful lot like smokey!!! Look it up… there seem to be a lot of clues there

Its the little things like this which make Lost the program it is!!!

ps one of the characters is called Charles “Wallace”

It really is a great conversation…and just when I thought I was done with theory for a while. Well, here is something about Desmond:

It seems to me that Desmond was the only persion we know of that may have been brought to the island by MIB. I think he is the true candidate for MIB. That’s why it’s important he come back…even by force. He was manipulated by Widmore, Hawking, Brother Campbell ( pictured w/ Hawking on his monk desk ), D. Faraday ( as a constant ), and maybe even Libby ( even though more likely a coincidece ).

Interesting, but probably not important: What’s sort of neat is that Desmond has flashes that tell him people’s future and Smokey uses flashes to see their past’s.

I think MIB, Widmore, Hawking, etc. all conspired to get Des to the island the first time and since he would not go back willingly he will be brought back by force. I think that as Hawking sacrificed her son to fate by sending him to the past to be shot knowingly it will prove that Charles Widmore will have to make a sacrafice of his daughter Penny’s either happiness or life perhaps even to make this so. “It’s a sacrifice that the island demands.” ( John Locke ) It’s MIB’s requirement that you prove “You have what it takes.” ( Christian Sheppard ). It’s why Ben who was unknowingly working for MIB and not Jacob would strap John’s father to a pillar and demand his son slit his throat. It’s why, upon failing to do that, he would proclaim “He’s not who we thought he was”. And why Richard would shortly thereafter, hoping to replace Ben and thinking that John may be special because of their history show him a way to have Sawyer do the deed for him.

Gotta get back to work, but thought you all could run with that if it sounds plausable…

I am happy to see a further Sawyer/Kate connnection, whereever it ends up — there is always fireworks when those two are on screen together

As far as how “deeply” Sawyer was into Juliet… how deeply was Sayid into Shannon?? If you can’t be with the one you love…..

What is the purpose of the flash sideways?? I feel like I am watching another TV show…and I’m not too in to it, to be honest.

Someone shared a theory: that the characters and storylines are all images of one’s fragmented personality (like John Cusack in movie: Identity). I really hope not!!!

I like this parallel to those who often do evil thinking it is God’s will, and with the idea of a benevolent but detached God who allows free will to play out versus a caniving devil that constantly tempts and corrupts God’s would-be followers.

I expressed the same confusion, but we have to realize that’s a product of the convoluted narrative structure. There are still “missing pieces” out there. You don’t become aware of Keyser Soze before that final, culminating moment.

My money is on something that will freak out MiB…. or perhaps kill him or entrap him. If not that then Des.

But was Widmore coming prepared for MiB (how would he know he has escaped ?) or is it something to “tame” Ben who was always his nemisis. What could tame Ben ? He let Alex die and is there anyone else ?

Then again we heard MiB talk about his mother … surely not ???

Oh and if they turn that plane around and fly off the island I’m going to laugh until it hurts. They would be inventing a new term for ‘jumping the shark’ …. as in that show has really ‘flown the LOST plane’.

Oh and BTW I liked this episode. For one thing, Charlotte cleaned up very nicely. Liked the Sawyer:Miles cop team. Didn’t like Kate showing up at te end. On island may have been a bit slow but hardly a “What Kate Does”.

I definitely think that Widmore is on Team Jaob, based on it being the MIB that made Locke think he had to die, and Widmore doing his best to prevent Locke from dying, to avoid “the wrong side winning”

I just really hope the remaining episodes end up illustarting exactly what the MIB’s agenda has been throughout the earlier series, so we don’t have to retrofit the story to make it fit with his agenda

We have always being handed early on the duality of Man of Faith, man of Science and free will and destiny/fate. What if the concept that emerges is not one of either/or but rahter of AND.

Meaning that it is not about either choosing free will or destiny/fate but having both free will and destiny/fate. The Sideverse is perhaps what happens when you combine both these concepts. You can make free choices and thereby nudging fate in a direction which may be slightly different than if you had abandoned yourself to pure fate.

Clearly I am no philosopher

More probable is that Desmond will come back in the flash sideways as we’ve seen him there already.

It was almost as if the script was composed entirely from lines of previous episodes. There were so many list cliches like “what are you doing here” and “why are you telling me this”.

Also I hated the super-unsubtle locked sub door foreshadow. Who the hell finds a locked door so noteworthy? That’s not intriguing that’s just crap.

“While the Barracks were under siege by Martin Keamy and his team of mercenaries after they killed Ben’s daughter Alex, Ben was able to call the Man in Black through a secret room in his house. The Man in Black appeared as a single, long, fast-moving black cloud that ran parallel to the ground. He proceeded to attack the mercenaries while Ben and Locke’s group escaped from his house. While only one of the mercenaries was seriously injured in the Man on Black’s attack, he caused a great deal of confusion and panic amongst his victims, who fired upon him in vain. Keamy grimly described the Monster as “a black pillar of smoke”. During the attack, he tore a tree’s roots out of the ground. The Monster appeared larger than previously seen in this form, forming a black cloud that swirled around all of the mercenaries. (“The Shape of Things to Come”) “

Honestly, I can argue for many theories … I don’t think we have the full picture yet or rather enough information to form a correct hypothesis.

I don’t think that Ben really knows much about Smokey. When he came to the Island as a child, the Dharma compound already had the Sonic fence in place. He probably knew that the fence kept Smokey out. When he took over the leadership or before that someone may have told him that here was a secret way to bring out the monster (or did he think it was a security system?) In any event, when Ben summoned it in Dead is Dead last season, here is what he said to Sun on the porch:

BEN: You may want to go inside.

SUN: Why?

BEN: Because what’s about to come out of that jungle is something I can’t control.

and of couse, Locke walks out of the jungle.

For those who think that Widmore is with Flocke : When Smokey was summoned by Ben the first time to go after Keeme and company … Smokey only chased them away – he did not kill them, which at the time had really surprised me. Did Flocke spare them because he knew the freighter was spent by Widmore??

We know Ilana’s group tried to stop Miles joining the freighter to the island, a freighter that we subsequently learn belongs to Widmore. The freighter’s mission is a pretty evil one: to kill everyone on the island and Ben and the Others are certainly against the freighter. This would suggest that the freighter is against Jacob and thus on MiB’s side. The problem here though is that Smokey killed the frieghter folk. That don’t make sense given that we now know that Smokey is MiB.

Okay, say Smokey was confused. Say he hadn’t checked his email that day, missed the message from Widmore saying ‘don’t kill my soldiers’, killed the wrong people, checked his messages and went D’oh! That leaves open the possibility that Widmore and MiB are allies. Yet this week seemed to prove the opposite. Widmore appears to be against MiB. I do like the theory that the whole point of Recon was to test Sawyer’s loyalty (i.e. Widmore and MiB are in cahoots) but I think with Widmore’s group erecting sonic fences, that seems unlikely. Widmore wouldn’t need to erect a fence to convince Sawyer and I wouldn’t think the expense and effort could be justified unless the fences are truly needed. Unless, of course, they are in cahoots but Widmore isn’t totally trusting of MiB. In that situation though, you’d think they would make sure that Sawyer doesn’t see the fence, lest that information gets back to MiB.

So, if Widmore is with Jacob, why did he send a freighter to kill everybody on the island? That doesn’t sound like something Jacob would want. Hmm, maybe that’s the point. He’s like a religious fanatic, committing violent acts in the service of his god. I just don’t know and I’m kinda sick of trying to theorise.

Okay, so with Widmore on Jacob’s side, where does that leave Ben? He is most definitely against Widmore and has been for a long time. Perhaps their conflict is based on a misunderstanding about the island and about Jacob. For a while it appeared that Ben might have been following MiB while thinking he was following Jacob but as time runs out with this series, I’m not sure that will be the case (and, in fact, if true, it means that Ben had no reason to be upset with Jacob to the point of killing him. He hadn’t been doing Jacob’s work at all).

I just can’t seem to work out a consistent framework for understanding allegiances. Maybe by series end it will make sense but I’ve got this uneasy feeling that the writers aren’t trying to make it make sense. And as I mentioned last week, this confused feeling I have with the show is making it a bit difficult to fully engage with the story. Still enjoying it but it doesn’t have the WOW factor that gripped me for five seasons.

And it doesn’t make sense why MIB would try and coax Ben to go over to the Hydra island considering it seems like Ben has been unknowingly possibly following his instructions for a very long time. It seems like he would want him on his side…and Widmore and Ben are feuding..why put him over there.

It seems like both sides have an interest in Locke. Richard visited him in the hospital when he was born as a preemie…as well as when he was a kid and Richard is on Jacob’s side. But then Christian tells Locke to turn the wheel…then ends up getting killed by Ben after Widmore tells Locke he needs to go BACK to the island. It’s all too mind boggling. UGH!

To add a comment too on what initially appeared to be some gratuitous sex in the flash sideways with Sawyer… Obviously Sawyer is a character with an easy way with finding willing sexual partners, however, in the island scene, where he finds Kate’s dress, and is reminded of their tryst in the cage, I think we’re being shown that Kate was indeed special to him -an ally he could trust when he was trapped.

With his grief over losing Juliet, he had lost sight of her importance, but regained that insight coming upon those cages, which is why after sending her away a few episodes back, this episode finds him hatching a plan which includes her escape as well as his own.

In some ways, I see Kate and Sawyer as male and female versions of the same character -fugitives operating one step ahead of the law, and always at risk of their pasts being discovered. Where as Jack and Juliet have traditionally represented professionals who long to be grounded in safe domesticity, far away from the Island, Kate and Sawyer were born to run.

Like someone above mentioned, the season is (in typical LOST fashion) gaining momentum. I don’t need answers every five seconds. I don’t need to anticipate every move that’s about to occur. I loved how I kept second-guessing Sawyer. Is he lying to Widmore? Is he lying to MIB? Both? Yes!

The only part of the story that was not believable to me was that Miles and James are equal-partners in the flash-sideways. I have never seen Miles as a working equal to James and it rattled me a tad that they were presented that way. A very small wrinkle that in no way diminishes my satisfaction with the episode.

Carry on!

@Nuckingfuts – Team Dark. Yes, Flocke has proved a discomfitting figurehead, no? Evil Incarnate? Sheesh! But, trapped on the island for a long time, kept there by his nemesis who he cannot unseat or displace, I think his goodness has been tested beyond his endurance. [ Is he Erin? Well, after that scene with Kate, it has some very attractive attributes as a theory/explanation, but I will not hide my reluctance to envision the scenario that would make that possible. ] I will again invoke the contrariness of the writing talent. Our baddies (Widmore and Flocke) are not only in cahoots, and not pointing towards a shoot out, but are also not the bad guys. Note: does not mean they are the ‘good’ guys. I continue to postulate that the good guys are OUR Losties. I could give various permutations and interpretations, but I welcome to hear yours, y’all everybody.

I have rewatched the ‘deal’ scene between Sawyer and Widmore, and besides marveling at the acting talent on display, I continue to find Widmore reserved, non-committal, and displaying amusement at Sawyer’s offer. I think he was figuring a way to use Sawyer to his own end, but NOT the way Sawyer was proferring himself.

Sir Charles has always been portrayed in a bad (evil) light, with instances too numerous to mention. But, he told Des where to find Eloise, no? He made a personal appearance to meet Locke in Tunisia and had Abadon chauffeur him about, right? He has not waffled in his feelings towards Ben. And, when last we saw Desmond (besides his ghost-like appearance on alt-815) he was in the hospital, and down at the exit Eloise met Charles and revealed Des’s parentage, no? So, where do Des and Dad Widdy go from there??? IS Des on board the sub, behind a locked door?

I digress. Sir Charles is worried the ‘wrong’ side will win. He has his own agenda after having his leadership stripped and being kicked off the island, and that may play large in his appreciation of the ‘wrong’ side. But I think his allegiances may have predated his expulsion, and may figure into that expulsion. That ‘relationship off the island’ always seemed a bit light, and more of a Linus technicality to get rid of him. Either way, I see Sir Charles as MIB ally. And no friend to Jacob. I don’t think lack of knowledge of the island’s whereabouts has kept him from returning. Jacob’s existence has. But with Jacob dead, here he is. But why? Is Jacob not dead enough? Is Jacob’s will being expressed beyond the grave, and has it found embodiment in Hurley, Jack, and possibly Richard (next week, cannot wait). Is that embodiment of will good, bad, or just another obstacle for control??? Stay tuned, and stay Darke.

I have a major problem with the direction lost is taking in it’s final season. I don’t like the good vs. evil set up. This show has always been about blurring those line, showing that good people can do evil things (Sayid, Kate, Sawyer) and that good people with good intentions can totally screw things up. For everyone. (Think, Locke, Jack). And that no one is ever completely what they may seem. I’m hoping (and past Lost-logic dictates) that we are being setup for a major game changer.

Random out there theory: The flash sideways losties will end up on the island, confronted with their stuck on the island dopplegangers and all craziness will ensue.

i wonder this because he seems to know about kate’s past but i don’t remember if he touched her at all. but he knows things because smokey took the form of that horse.

@chuck in indy i agree with you that widmore’s people were probably the ones in the outrigger last season. i still want to see it in action. i thought for sure that would be the “wow” moment in recon when sawyer got in one.

i know the writers will come through in the end, and all these set-up episodes will payoff.

as far the locked door, i hope that mystery doesn’t drag out too long. what’s in there? or who? could it be desmond?

Did anyone else notice some sort of neon carnival ride in the night sky behind Charlotte when Sawyer came to see her? Maybe Ryan knows where it was filmed. It almost looked like the London Eye.

Sawyer told Charlotte that the tee shirt was in the top right drawer and she opened the left one. It looked like she was looking for something, but she could have been digging around for a tee shirt, since there wasn’t any in that drawer.

Will Kate please tell Claire that her mother has Aaron already? Maybe she won’t try to kill you again. I didn’t trust that hug.

Also, I forgot to include the timing of Sayid’s visit from Jacob, which was sometime in 2005, when Nadia was killed crossing a busy street.

I wanted to also mention I listened to The TV Critics podcast today and he had a fantastic idea about Sun not transporting with the other Losties to 1977 b/c she was not the Kwon who is the candidate – so more evidence that Jin is the Kwon Candidate and not Sun.

@ Rusty – I like your thoughts on the time line

@Constance – Cooper as Ford’s real father – now that would be a twist!

@Genevieve – Good assessment of Sawyer’s emotional State of mind when he visited the Cages set

@Russell – I like your explanation of Claire’s Pyschic encounter

Or maybe Smokie’s crazy mother is some of the real John Locke’s personality starting to shine through?

@ Rich in Cleveland : completely agree with you about diminishing one episode by comparing it with another (in this case Dr. Linus versu Recon). At this stage of the game, the writers are telling us the story of this Island knowing that there is a deadline – whatever they are giving us – must be given and must have some significance even if we may not recognize that significance yet.

Why Sawyer did not turn in Kate in the elevator : Because he was in Australia where he was not supposed to be and if he would have interferred he would have come to explain why he was at the airport. I think Mini had the same thinking on that point.

Food for thought : MIB can’t leave the Island so long as there are people on it. So he gives them a choice, either get killed or asks them to follow him off the Island. This would explain why is goes to see Jacob on the beach because Jacob is bringing in the Black Rock… jacob keeps bringing new people to the Island which keeps MIB from leaving.

Food for thought : I don’t believe the Sideways world is due to the bomb either blowing up or not – rather it is caused by the fact of Jacob’s death somehow. I am not sure I can explain it yet but for years and years Jacob was always on the Island (with MIB) and now he is no longer ‘alive’. I think this is significant.

AND I can’t wait to rewatch the entire series from the beginning once we understand the bigger picture. Hopefully then we’ll be able to answer all the little questions on our own.

@bluedog1121 – Miles’ name was still “Miles Straume” off-island. He had a name plate on his desk at the police station.

@hanakoa – I like your theory about Richard’s lineage going back to Egypt.

Ryan & Jen – you guys are awesome. Ua hana pa’a maika’i ‘olua!

To Meredith in VA: I don’t think the writers are going to answer questions like why LaFleur was Sawyer’s choice of names @dharmaville, and other smaller questions. They’re only going to answer the big major ones so you might not be satisfied at the end if you want the answers to everything. But I’m sure there are a lot of fans like you out there.

I heard the theory kicked around before, but as I watched the episode and listened to UnLocke explain to Kate how his mother was crazy, I couldn’t help but see the parallels.

He said he had “growing pains” that would not have been there “had things been different.” Could that difference be no island or a sunken island? If Jacob never summoned the Losties, the plane never would have crashed as we see in the Sideways World. So he would have never been separated from his mother. And think about how he looked at Kate when she first emerged from the Temple in Sundown, and how he protected her in Recon. It stands to reason that he would recognize her and care for her since she was the one who raised him.

On top of that, think all the way back to the first season when Claire visited the psychic and how terrified the psychic was about what he saw. That would really bring the story full circle if we find out the psychic was peering into the soul of the future MIB.

Things I loved:
Cop Sawyer with his partner Miles. I love those two together!
Sawyer watching “Little House on the Prairie”
Sawyer reading “Watership Down” and eating rabbit on the island. lol
Seeing Liam Pace again… but when do we get to see Charlie?
Crazy Claire and the squirrel baby. She is NUTS. And I’d really love it if she washed her hair.

Things I wasn’t crazy about:
Seeing Charlotte with Sawyer.
Seeing Kate running again, although hearing Sawyer say, “Sonofabitch” was fantastic! I missed that the last few weeks! Ha!

Things I’m curious about:
Who killed the Ajira folks?
Are MIB and Widmore enemies or really working together?
What’s in the locked room on the sub?
How the heck Sawyer’s going to drive a sub.

One last thing. I was really sad for Sawyer when he was back at the cages. I have heard people whining about how could he be reminiscing about Kate when he just lost Juliet, but I think it’s so much more than that. I took it as he was emotional over the whole cage experience… how he was held in a CAGE, how he ate freaking fish biscuits, how she saved his life by saying she loved him, and how they turned to each other for comfort. I think it just sort of hit him hard to remember that time and how awful it was. I won’t begrudge him that. I don’t think it means he’s shallow or his relationship wasn’t real, or he’s even moved on.

A good friend of mine added that perhaps the cage experience with Kate was his first real experience with love, and if it hadn’t been for that experience, he couldn’t have been in the right place to love Juliet.

“Recon” was a decent episode. I don’t think that many questions were answered but it moved the story along. I am convinced that they are laying all of the clues needed to understand the point of the sideflashes. I just can’t seem to connect the dots. Here are some:

1- We know that in the original timeline, Sawyer was 8 when his parents died. In the alt sideflash timeline, he was 9. And though we know he’s blaming Anthony Cooper, we don’t know why. Maybe it’s a different reason? Something to do with the “Lancelot” book on his dresser perhaps? Lancelot’s plot involved a man who killes his wife because he finds out that he’s not the father. What if Anthony Cooper is Ford’s real father??

2- Now we know that Pierre Chang and Miles get off the island. (If they were ever on it to begin with.) Something happened pre bomb.

3- A couple of reasons they chose Charlotte as his sideflash date: One, they wanted to show that she can clean up nice and two, they know that we want to see Juliette and they are toying with our emotions!

4- The differences between Claire and Sayid. Dogen said that Claire was claimed and Sayid was as well. But they are obviously different. I’m wondering if the difference is the fact that Claire had the vaccinations in S1 and if that has prevented a total turn to the dark side, like Sayid appears. Which begs the question, what is the vaccination?

5- Widmore and Smockey. Their reactions to Sawyer’s play seemed too agreeable. I think they may still be on the same side and are just seeing what Sawyer is going to do. Look at their eyes when Sawyer is telling them his plan. But then why is Widmore building the sonar fence?

6- What’s behind the locked door in the sub? Desmond??

Thank you! I look forward to your podcast on Sunday.

Regarding the sinking of the island, I think we can now narrow down the date this occurs. It did not occur in 1977 when Jughead exploded.

We already knew it occurs after Dharma arrives on the island (around 1970?), and now we can surmise that it occurs before the death of Sawyers parents in 1976. (We can probably narrow the date to before 1974 as well. Wild ass guess = 1972)

Look at the approximate date the Jacob visited each of the candidates. Sawyer was visited at his parents’ funeral in 1976. Kate was visited when she was a girl sometime in the 1980s. Locke was visited after he fell from the window; Jack was working as a surgeon. These events probably occurred in the late 1990s. Jin and Sun’s wedding was also in this time period, or maybe a little later. Hurley was visited in 2007.

My conclusion is that the sinking of the island precludes Jacob from ever visiting the candidates. Since Sawyer was visited first (in 1976), the sinking (and therefore the timeline divergence) must have occurred prior to that date.

Events prior to the sinking remain consistent.

MIB says that “It was a long and traumatic night for all of us”. Do you think he was really traumatized?

I agree w/ KCBOB & the others who think it makes perfect since that Sawyer would not help capture Kate @ the airport for two reasons: He does not want a bunch of press about how an off-duty cop caught a woman on the run. ( I am assuming in FSW world that the news is still the same and would make a big to-do about it ) which would cause friction w/ Miles, and possibly questions after or at the time he takes care of Cooper. And another reason is that he obviously works ‘under-cover’ ( which he takes to the extreme, but granted I don’t think he minds ). He doesn’t want to blow that up either.

About Team Dark vs. Team Jacob. Although I “Swore my allegiance to the Dark side” a few episodes ago, does not mean that I am not for a little ‘balance to the force’. In Star Wars even the good go bad and the bad can go good again. As the obviously flawed, ill-conceived, often ridiculed ( deservedly so ) pre-quels the point is made by Yoda that perhaps the prophecy was mis-read. The fact is that the Jedi at the time actually out-weighed the Sith by far. The prophecy was that Anakin would bring balance to the force…and he did…by killing all the Jedi down to an even number of dark vs. light. It should also be noted that Anakin’s goals were peace, unity, and to bring back a loved one…at any cost. Some would argue that he was trying to do the right thing and that his philosophy changed to “The ends justify the means” while others think that there must be a line that can not be crossed. But once you go down the path of the Dark Side you can never come back…so I’ll stick with team black. I think LOST will end similar, given the pre-disposition to Star Wars that the writers have and how even Hurley stated that there are some things that he would try to change. Perhaps another ‘mirrored’ reason my sub-conscious loves LOST is that it is making up for much of what Star Wars could have been.

I also wanted to say in regards to the fact that I have chosen a team. I don’t want to be wrong, but I admit that there is a probability that I am not right. I am really more worried that the real story is not about MIB going home, but perhaps about keeping him from escaping and doing harm to the ‘real world’. I don’t think that the island is what needs protection from Smokey, but perhaps that the world does. I imagine it like Kong coming over to NYC. On his island he was honored and respected, but when let loose upon the city he was damaging and caused chaos ( whether or not he intended that ). It ‘mirrors’ the statement that was made before from the real John Locke / or Ben that if people new of the powers of the island they would over-run it and abuse it. So in as much as the island needs protection from too many people, the world needs protection from the island.

None of us has all the answers, which is the fun of it. I think that it is much like someone said here a few episodes ago, it’s like rooting for a football team or something. I live in Atlanta, so when Mike Vick was in trouble & did bad I did not agree, but I still rooted for my team…even though they did not win a Super Bowl….but it was still fun which is why I chose Team Dark ( though I did not know about team Sawyer at the time ). If I choose no teams at all it would be less fun….If I don’t care for a sport, then I don’t have a team. If I don’t have a team, then I don’t care who wins. I care for LOST so I had to pick a team. So get off the fence, people! “Choose your destiny”.

The thing I like about my team is that MIB at least tells it like it is. It seems. He tells Kate that Claire needed someone to hate at the time to keep her going. Week to week during a football season we muster our ‘hate’ of the other teams and it gets us by, gives us a reason to go on and care, even when our team stinks…which the Atlanta Falcons have done more of than less of in the past…

Best episode ever, no….but not every game is good either….Josh Holloway was so good as a cop and it felt so right I think that it took away from the Sawyer was a cop shock. I can’t wait for an action movie or two by him down the pipe…

There are some really smart people who post here – I have always wanted to point that out.

@ Bill – I thought the same thing about the fact that the plane had a broken windshield. Maybe they can use the magic box.

Best line: Sawyer – “Take me to your leader”.

One, as a refresher for the season since someone coming in might not know about it… blah blah blah.

Two, is it just me or is Miles’ power more closely aligned with how “the smoke thing” works?

Hurley interacts with the actual manifestation of a former person. They can actually talk to each other. While Miles sees the last things they were thinking/feeling before they died and how they died. Seems a lot more like how Unlocke described Locke’s demise.

Anyway, I’m sure someone pointed that out already… but there’s so many comments now it’s hard to keep up.

In the novel, a group of rabbits flee their home as it is destroyed by men constructing a housing estate. On their travels they face many hardships – crossing a river, meeting various predators and being shot by a man. Interestingly, they meet two very different societys – one a society which is essentially a warren that a farmer has maintained so he can harvest the rabbits as he requires (which the rabbits themselves are resigned to)and two an almost totalitarian controlled warren under the reign of the terrifying General Woundwort. The original rabbits make their way through all this to create a new warren.

A sub-plot in the story is the rabbit’s Prince El-erererah, whom the rabbits tell stories about concerning tricks. Their god Lord Frith is the Sun and their devil is the Black Rabbit of Inle (Inlay), whom they see before they die “When he calls you, you have to go”.

There may be lots of parallels but the obvious fight between good and evil is apparent. I can’t help feeling there is something else though, regarding the journey and the subplot. Great episode, love the podcast!!!!Thoughts?

Marmee, the idea that the Jughead didn’t explode has been floated and discussed quite a lot. It absolutely is not certain it exploded, yet it is not clear it did not.

docjkm, your replies – on the mark. Your admonishment that in order to appreciate the show, we have to let it develop, also, on the mark.

But I did want to make a comment about Claire’s mock baby. I came across this image(http://tinyurl.com/yackdzy), on the left is a sticker a friend made of a baby Baphomet and it reminded me of Claire’s “squirrel baby”.

According to famed Satan worshipper Alistair Crowley, Baphomet is symbolic of a magical child and representative of a union of opposites. Baphomet is however most commonly represented as a demon, devil, or other sort of dark force. I think this is further indication that MIL is on the dark side (plus hitting women is NEVER a good sign). I also wonder what this might all mean about the real Aaron.

My prediction of Miles’ girlfriend – Naomi, didn’t he try to hit on her before?

I keep waiting for Faraday to show up. The question is will he be wearing a tie in the flash sideways? lol

I still don’t trust Ben, I rewatched Dr. Linus and after he gave his emmy moment speech, when Ilana said she would take him, he almost had a look like “you fell for that?” I think ultimately Ben always chooses what is best for Ben. He says he chose the island over Alex, but he chose himself, because he was the one Keamy would have shot.

@Nate- totally agree, Lost is the best show on tv! I was fine with the episode. I know we all wish for more action and answers, but they will cram all that into the last 6 episodes and we won’t be able to catch our breath.

@Ed – love your show ideas, wish you worked for ABC!

@Russell – your comments about Widmore’s nerdy “henchmen” caught me while drinking water and it was so funny I started choking. So true, how did he pick these losers. Did you notice the man who used to be the boy on the 80′s sitcom – Kate and Ali?

@KC Bob- I think you are exactly right about James not giving Kate away because he didn’t want to call attention to himself. Plus he found the whole situation funny.

@Rich – still think your theory has a lot of merit.

Also to the people talking about the Charlotte and the sheet and the hotel walk of shame. Very funny!

@Meredith, Damon says we will see Vincent again. I think He tends to show up in the last episode.

My theory on why James did not attempt to apprehend Kate in LA X is that he didn’t want anyone to know he had been out of the country. Had he arrested her there, his fellow officers (like Miles) would have known.

Other than that I liked this episode alot more than most it seems. This episode finally made me feel like we are in the endgame. Sure the episode was mostly setup…but good set up. Also I loved the scene with Flocke and Kate and the talk of a crazy mother. If Flocke is the bad guy (and I believe he is) then this moment makes him more sympathetic and I find that sympathetic bad guys much more interesting in a story than just pure evil.

@geef – Bravo! Lost is not for the kiddies, and not because of too much sex. Hardly.

@Joe in Texas – Join. Team Darke. Yes, FLocke good. Smacking Claire upset people? She puts axe in Temple goon’s chest and tries to take Kate’s head off for her new ‘dolly’, and a smack to quiet her down is upsetting??? Somebody’s ‘lost’ here. BTW – worth replay to watch Sayid’s non-response, non-expression when Kate calls to him for help. The boy can act.

@RussellinRaleigh – well observed. Widmore sends Kimi and the mercenary GIJoes on the freighter, yet travels with ex-Mickey Mouse club castoffs as his posse??? Those guys looked really scary, huh. Something really there in that observation. Will be thinking on that, and suspecting it has relationship to what’s in the locked cabin on the sub?

@BenMc – I am quite uncertain that we know Flocke is evil incarnate. I do agree that the potential for Sawyer being played by Flocke/Widmore is more than a ‘neat idea’ to me. The idea of transferring Jacob/MIB to God/Satan status just does not work for me at all. I think this is more morally grey, and that the good or evil is in the Choice itself. The good will come from out Losties, they will not discover it, they will BE it.

@ Gretchen – “shirtless Sawyer having sex with stupid Charlotte bad” camp. Please! She looked so good I was about to have it off with my TV set! @BonitainAtlanta – *I* am a pervert.

“Scheming Charlotte”… of course she was! Seduction too easy, request for T-shirt ‘off’, and search of drawer very obviously not pointless. We will be seeing her again in the Sideways world.

@BethinSac – methinks thou art yet too harsh. Layers are laid, and schemes afoot. And of your addressless questions, one best way to find out. Not volunteering, mind you, but you should get out.

Folks, we are building for a climax, no? Building. This episode was building, and should be appreciated appropriately. Stunning surprise, suspense, and HFC moments one after the other would wear quite thin even in the short time left. Things need tweaking, adjustment, and prewiring. Set-up. Good set-up is admirable. And Lost is that and more.

Why are we assuming Jughead blew up? As Season 5 ended, Juliet was trying to make the bomb go off, then we see a bright light and it’s on to Season 6. Season 6 (on island) begins with a time shift (explaining the bright light).

In the flash sideways, we see our island underwater. I’m no expert on bombs, but it seems if a bomb can sink an island it would also demolish the Dharma houses and statue on the island. I just don’t think Jughead blowing up in 1977 should influence our end theories.

My own theory? That our island has been popping up in different places around the world throughout history, which explains all of the different cultures represented on the island. I think our island inspired the Atlantis myth of the ancient Greeks, too. Now what that has to do with the end of the story, I have no idea

People are saying it was a slow episode, but why is that a bad thing? I still enjoyed it. It’s still better than anything else on tv.

The creepiest part of the whole episode occurred when Claire jumped Kate and held a knife to her throat and Sayid just sat there in complete indifference.

Enough said.

I have this book in my collection so I got it off the shelf and paged through it a bit. The jacket cover says,” Watership Down is a remarkable tale of exile and survival, of heroism and leadership…an epic novel of a group of adventurers who desert their doomed city, and venture forth against all oods on a quest for a new home, a sturdier future.”

For those who don’t know it, the story is about a band of rabbits and I guess you could compare it to TLOTR and TLTWATW. Only rabbits. Everything is seen through a rabbits point of view as they battle enemies from the animal world like weasels and foxes and this really scary big evil black rabbit, and the human world. Example of the rabbit’s perspective of the human world intersecting theirs:

A description of a locomotive at night on page 215: “an enormous thing” “full of fire and smoke and light and it roared and beat on the metal lines until the ground shook beneath it” “like a thousand thunderstorms with lightning” ”they split the whole night apart”.

I could go on… but I think you get the idea.

I like when the writers stick stuff like this in the background.

THIS!!!!!!!!!!

Don’t think the conspiracy theorist in me hasn’t wondered if they are doing exactly that…

“The Long Con” indeed

If someone is going to attempt to fly the Aijira plane (Flight 316), doesn’t it have a broken cockpit window where sizable tree limb impaled the co-pilot?

HEY! Wait a minute… how did Sawyer and FLocke get out of the cave with the names? The top ladder broke away from the rock cliff. The only other way out was the ocean below. No thanks.

Widmore can’t leave the sub until the sonic fence is powered up. Why didn’t the Temple have a sonic fence?

There has to be a connection between dead bodies that are buried and the ones just laying out in the open.

The Honolulu film location where Sawyer slams Kate up against the gate was the same alley/street seen in the episode “Stranger in a Strange Land” – or as I call it “Jack’s Tattoo”. The worst episode of the series.

If MiB killed them why would Widmore have his folks drag ‘em all into a pile in the jungle? There were drag marks in the sand, and I think if MiB wanted them put out of the way he woulda carried them smokey-style instead of dragging them.

Two things about those bodies. First, they are evidently pretty stinky. Although the time line is hazy, Widmore hasn’t been there long enough to produce corpses that smelly. Secondly, there isn’t a bullet hole on any of them. I went back to look for that specifically. Smokey kills by tossing and breaking people. Widmore, presumably, would have shot them.

MIB wants to know what Widmore is doing and probably doesn’t care if Sawyer sees the bodies. Sawyer already knows that he took down the temple in pretty brutal fashion.

Way back in the day prisoners of war could be used as slaves, prisoners, whathaveyou. Sure we picture the mass capturing of Africans when we think of it but there have been slaves that were Irish, Polish, Danish, Russian, Middle Eastern, Asian, etc….

I definitely don’t read into race as a basis for whether or not Richard could have been a slave. I can’t wait until his episode when we find out! I cannot imagine a way that the Richard show won’t be huge.

Good theory about Richard being on Black Rock crew. Never made sense to me. White man on 1800′s slave ship does not = slave.

But, yeah, either Rebecca Mader (Charlotte) totally botched the t-shirt digging scene, or (more realistically) she’s conning Sawyer with sex, just as he conned the woman in the opening scene. Mirror, mirror…

ALTHOUGH…. If Sawyer had something that sensitive in the t-shirt drawer, he would have gotten her the shirt himself.

But also, I still don’t even know who was taking the form of Christian….I thought it was Flocke, but apparently he is stuck in his current form. WHO IS CHRISTIAN? Last time we saw Christian on the island was with Sun and Lapidus–is that correct?

I suppose another possible unanswered question, but its really bothering me. Can someone help me?

haha evil tina…that is the most awesome thing anyone has ever written on this post.

What if you left your car keys in the room? How do you get them back? Do you have to go back to the room and do a knock of shame?

These issues must be addressed.

Also, the Charlotte thing felt completely nonsensical to me, like the writers just want to pull a GOTCHA! on the viewers. With the addition of Liam showing up for no reason, this felt like a bizarre “circus of the stars” parade. Who will they bring back next! Ho ho ho!

Sawyer getting so bent out of shape over Charlotte finding the folder? Weak!
Miles breaking up with Sawyer because he didn’t tell him where he was spending the weekend? Weak!
Sawyer showing up in the middle of the night with a six-pack of apology beer? Weak! (And kind of gross…beer doesn’t equal apology…if anything, beer equals booty call)

Sigh…I can’t wait until next week’s episode. If the official Lost Podcast is to be believed, it will be something of a turning point.

Resigned Sayid freaks me out more than Killing Sayid.

Even if I don’t quite buy it, it is very interesting to look at MiB as another broken character that has their own issues… And maybe needs his own redemption.

Scheming Charlotte? Is that all it was about, a shirt? Methinksnot.

Love the double con. And in a dense moment it took til today to realize that Recon is what Sawyer was asked to do by MiB but Re-Con is what he actually did.

Side note – I think Kate’s gonna have a big part eventually. They are spending too much time trying to show us how meaningless she is.

Quite a jump from grieving-over-Juliet Sawyer to sadly-looking-at-Kate’s-dress Sawyer.

I don’t buy the suddenly sorrowful Claire.

I don’t buy the suddenly sentimental FLocke.

LOL @ Lost and Order.

Does Sawyer get to have sex with every reasonably attractive woman on the show? I expected Claire to get back to her hut to find candles burning and Sawyer bearing sunflowers.

@ Matio – Your take on Richard makes sense to me.

@ PainterGirl – Could be that the FSW daddy of Locke isn’t “The” Anthony Cooper as you suggested but how cool if he “IS” and the death of Ford’s Parents is what ended is conning career and allowed a relationship to grow with his dad?

@ LucyDog – I think you called it – Locke wanting to work on Kate was the real reason for Sawyer’s “mission”.

@ Montreal – you’re not a pervert, I’m sure Ford collaring Kate was intended to be a reflection of the Cage Match.

Off the top of my head:

- Alt-Sawyer conning a woman as part of police work.
- Pa from Little House on the Prairie telling the big lie of the afterlife to Laura, so she won’t feel so bad about death.
- MiB lying to Claire about her baby to give her a purpose, a reason to continue.
- Sawyer lying to Miles about his trip to Australia to hide his pursuit of justice.
- Sawyer lying to both Whidmore and MiB to get himself and Kate off the island.

(I just watched “The Invention of Lying” the other night, which gives many scenarios where lying can be good or bad, depending on circumstances.)

Anyhow, it drives towards the central theme of the duality of human nature — that lying, typically seen as a bad thing, can be a good thing if used correctly. I wonder if Jacob and MiB will end up working together by the end of the series?

One other thing: It was funny to see the mirror image scene of Alt-Sawyer calling in the cops on his con target vs. the scene of Evil Tina Fey (yes, that’s her new name) calling in the troops on Sawyer. Both of them were lying about their identities, and when they were busted, they called in the cavalry! Actually, I didn’t recognize the woman alt-Sawyer cons in the beginning of the episode — was that possibly alternate-reality Evil Tina Fey?

I also think that because both Jack and Sawyer have asserted themselves this season and assumed a more proactive leadership role it sets up well for some sort of conflict between the two again before the series end. The problem is that it’s hard to say it translates to a Jacob vs MIB conflict because I truly believe Sawyer when he says ‘I’m not with anybody’.

My theory about all the mirror sequences in the FSW is that they are trying to tell us that we shouldn’t be looking at 2007 on Island as the main timeline but think of the two timelines as mirror images. So instead of timeline 1 and timeline 2 they are timeline 1a and timeline 1b. I’m not sure where that goes when the inevitable reconciliation occurs.

He has a certain Egyptian look to him with the dark hair and good tan and there have been a lot of Egyptian themes. It wouldn’t surprise me to discover that MIB was born to his abusive mom back in ancient Egypt and they picked up Richard along the way.

I think we learned a little more about Widmore’s deal. That was cool. And I was extremely relieved to learn that there weren’t Other Other Others!

And I’m totally in the “shirtless Sawyer good – shirtless Sawyer having sex with stupid Charlotte bad” camp.

Ryan and Jen….HURRY UP!!! WE NEED YOUR INSIGHT!

Now that we know of his connection to the Black Rock, many are assuming that Richard was a slave. I am not 100% on this, but I don’t think there were too many Caucasian slaves being traded during the time of the Black Rock. I think most slaves during that period (1650-to-1850-ish) were from Africa. That would make Richard part of the crew, or even possible the captain of the Black Rock.

Here is my tin-foil-hat theory: What if Richard’s association with Jacob goes back farther than the Black Rock, as far back as Egyptian times, possibly. Richard could be thousands of years old. His sole purpose is to act as Jacob’s agent on the Outside, helping to bring Others to the Island. Thus, while he was on the Black Rock, and from what he infers about the voyage, it wasn’t pleasant, it wasn’t what brought him to the Island and Jacob for the FIRST time. He was on the ship, bringing it and whoever was on it to the Island FOR Jacob as part of whatever little game Jacob is playing with the MIB.

We know Locke Monster is evil incarnate, now we learned that he had a crazy mother also overcome with evil like Claire.

There’s a locked door on the sub. Hmm.

Locke isn’t on anyone’s “side”. Atheist?

Locke Monster fills people with “hate” to drive them. He sounds even further devilish.

Locke Monster smacks around his little evil drones like they are nothing to him.

The Widmore thing – well, I don’t think they’ve really given us enough to go on, they want us to keep guessing a little. Notice that neither Widmore NOR Lock Monster commented on the self-concocted idea of Sawyer. They may be playing him.

Lastly, one thing I want to point out about good and evil. If you are still fighting that Jacob is supposed to represent God, think about this, God was never all butterflies, rainbows and smiles. There is something called the “wrath of God”. He allows you free will, he will let you repent to save your soul, BUT, God tests people (he tested his own son a few times), he purges villages of people who don’t believe, he manipulates situations to test the free will of the people.

But the devil – pretty simple. Deceitful, liar, violent, manipulative, hateful.

We’ve been thinking so much about the dads we forgot about all the dysfunctional relationships with the mothers.

Locke- Mom was crazy and gave him up to Anthony Cooper for money.
Sawyer – mom got involved with Anthony Cooper and lost all the family’s money and when his dad found out all hell broke loose.
Jack- his mom seems to be dependent on him for every little thing, wants him to “fix” everything.
Hurley- loving mom, but she never got over his dad leaving him.
Jin- mom was a prostitute, so he grew up not having a mom. Ironically he had a wonderful dad that he was ashamed of because he was a fisherman.
Kate- mom involved in abusive relationship, exposing Kate to a miserable life and leaving Kate’s stepdad the man she really looked up to and admired.
Clare- had a fight with her mom causing the accident that put her in a coma.
Daniel – Mom killed him (need I say more)
Miles- Mom never told him the truth about his father because she didn’t understand why she had to leave the island.
Shannon- stepmother made her life miserable
Boone – totally under his mother’s control

So Sawyer knew Kate was in handcuffs, yet did nothing about it in “What Kate Does”, yet they come full circle. Very nicely done. I also don’t think that Claire is done with Kate yet, but that’s just me.

Now onto what I really want to talk about and that is Richard Alpert. The glimpse of next weeks episode pretty much erased everything that happened on last nights episode. Between Daniel Faraday and Desmond, I have never been enthralled with a character so much, with so little known about him. Next weeks episode is titled “Ab Aeterno”. Latin for: since the beginning of time. We found out that Jacob touched him, but when? We’ll finally get that answered and man am I excited for it.

Okay, back to last nights episode. At first I thought that lady was simply a survivor off of the plane that didn’t go with Illana, Ben, Sun, Lapidus, etc. Then I thought she was a Protector along with Illana, then I realized that she was with Widmore. Given the fact that they were putting those beams up that encased the village, I’m going to go with that he knows way more about the Man In Black than anyone else, besides Jacob.

With that said, I’m going to segue into Charles telling Locke that if he didn’t go back to the island, the wrong side would win. As we can clearly see, for now, the wrong side is winning, unless Charles does in fact what Unlocke to win, but why would he want Sawyer to bring him to him for him to kill him? That’s a tad confusing. Anyway, that’s all I have to say about this episode.

Add this question to the list?
_ Who flew in the food drop to the Losties in Season 1? (The food Hurley found). Widmore doesn’t know where the Island is. The Dharma folks use the sub to go thru a portal in the ocean. Hmm?

Theory.. Locke’s (secret) half-brother is Ben (same mom). Locke’s name was on the wall, but crossed off.. maybe Ben is actually a candidate. Hmmm?

This contrast might shed some light on who’s aligned with whom. Recall that Sun was detained after accosting Widmore in London. The implication was that he controlled Oceanic Airlines as part of his vast empire thus strengthening his association with Jacob. Widmore’s allegiance to Jacob is not definitive and could be a test as Bronco said above.

Three things trouble me about this ambiguity.
1) If Widmore is aligned with Jacob, by the law of opposition, Ben must be an agent of the dark side. This would be so wickedly diabolical after they redeemed him last week. As I’ve speculated for some time, Ben has received his lists and instructions from Smokey masquerading as Jacob. However, the scene last week in which Smokey set Ben free undercuts the idea of Ben’s awareness that he is deep under cover.
2) Thy pylons are meant to be the dead giveaway that Widmore is trying to keep Smokey out. Are they? Is it possible they hinder the good visions, whether of Jacob or Eko or other benign spirits? Radio waves.
3) If Widmore is aligned with Jacob, then Jacob is just as capable of leaving a pile of dead bodies in his wake. Who went all Lord of the Flies on those people? For me, that really raised the stakes and created some cognitive dissonance.

Odd notes.
Did you see Zach lugging the Teddy Bear?
On the rewatch of “Dr. Linus” I thought I saw J-14 on the wall. Wasn’t that the alarm code that came over the phone when Alex disarmed the sonic fence for Keamy?

In the preview, Richard said “this place is not what you think it is.” I will be calling in when they all wake up from their dream.

My favorite line:
Miles to Sawyer when he was trying to set him up w/ Charlotte: “What. Do you want to die alone?”

@Mimi: I LOVE your theory that Windmore and Ben are the newer version of Jacob and MIB. Very interesting.

@John: I know you said the episode had no “holy crap!” moments that we love but for me, the holy crap moment was when Flocke talked about his disturbed mother. Who is his mother.?? What IS he?? It is keeping me up at night. I went to ABC.com and reread the summary of the “Cabin Fever” episode (sorry, I dont recall what season) and in that ep. Richard visits Locke as a young boy in foster care. Little Locke has a crayon drawing of a smoke monster and a person screaming. Richard gives him a comic book, a rusty knife, a vile of sand and compass. Richard asks Locke if any of the items beling to him and he inspects each one and picks up the sand and the knife. As he is fondling the knife Richard says “Are you sure” and Locke shakes head yes and RIchard leaves and tells the mom he’s not ready or it was a mistake or something.

My reason for mentioning all this is that Locke and smokey have had a connection since Locke was a kid. How, why, we dont know. John was a preemie who barely survived. Maybe this has something to do with it. Maybe the loophole MIB mentioned was used earlier than we thought. We assume the occupation took place when Locke died but maybe the transfer started when Locke was a baby and only was complete when Locke died.

Remember, the conversation about the loophole took place as the Black Rock ship was approaching the island. This was hundred’s of years before Locke’s birth. If MIB and Jacob are dieties than time is eternal.

In that same episode, Richard returns when Locke is a teenager and he is locked in a locker. The principal gets him out and takes him to the office to meet Richard who wants Locke to go to a special science camp. Locke isnt interested and the principal says, “Face it John, you are never going to be the hero, the football star, the homecoming king.” and Locke says, “Dont tell me what I cant do!” SO we never find out if Richard ever took Locke to camp and if he did, what happened there between him and Richard.

Does anyone remember exactly what Richard says the first time the two meet on the island? Does Locke remember him?

Does this have anyone else wondering??

I may be in the minority but fabulous episode. I just lost it when they had the extended Little House on the Prairie clip—-I think that was either the episode where Pa has to put down Laura’s horse Bunny or when Laura wishes her baby brother dies and he does die and she asks God to take her instead. Either episode is a complete weeper–with Pa talking about heaven and all. Poor sad Sawyer.

So, who is MIB’s [and possibly Jacob's] mommy and why does MIB have mommy issues? Was Charlotte really snooping and if so, why? (Speaking of Charlotte I so wanted her to turn on the stereo and say at some point, post lovemaking, “Oh, I love me some Geranomo Jackson.”) Why was Chip from “Kate and Allie” there?

I’m babbling but because I did like this episode. Mostly because I think the Sideways world is so interesting and I’m fascinating about how the Sideways world came to be. What made Sawyer still damaged but now a cop. I do fear that he’ll show up at Locke’s wedding and try to take out Anthony Cooper there (with Sayid and Nadia, the neighbors, in attendance, and with Boone and Shannon being the wedding planners, Hurley in attendance as Locke’s boss, et al..)

I go back and forth on this but MIB seems to really be the bad guy now with the motive of getting Sawyer off the island so he could get into Kate’s head. He is not to be trusted. Not as if we are to trust Jacob, but I do feel now that Locke’s motives are for him, and Jacob, for whatever reason, is trying to do something, good or bad, to the survivors.

Is the Anthony Cooper James Ford is looking for the dad that is invited to Locke’s wedding? Perhaps Locke was adopted instead of in foster care, and it is his adopted father that gets invited.

I can’t help but love MiB. He is so fatherly to Claire and Kate. His comments about disappointment and inappropriateness during this episode reminded me of Ilana’s comment that Jacob was the closest thing she had to a father. I guess all the best cowgirls also have daddy issues.

Ilana: Rewatching “Dr. Linus”, I noticed that Ilana seems quite upset whenever she mentions “the candidates”. I believe she is jealous that she was not chosen as a candidate. This jealousy will cause her to turn on the candidates at some point.

Richard: Was not a slave. Probably a member of the crew on the Black Rock. An uprising on the BR caused him to “end up in chains”. Jacob was able to recruit him into his current position due to Richards shame of being a slaver and desire for redemption.

Bonita, I like your analysis of Sawyer and his nicknames. Perhaps in this mirrored off-island reality, Juliet will prove to be the mother of Jack’s son, will have or develop some connection to Sawyer, too, and ultimately will see Sawyer die. Or maybe not. They can play the miiror game any number of ways. My favorite line: Sawyer’s (slightly) bonehead-sounding “MY CAR!”

Did you notice the expressions on Kate when, pinned to the gate, Sawyer tears off her hood. That was pretty convincing and immediate. I say Lily is a very good actress. You Kate-haters.

I didn’t think to look for it.

Notice that both Sawyer and Jack have broken mirrors this season.

I DO NOT want to see another new characters this season. Not ONE when we are still hanging for some old seemingly VERY important characters al la Faraday, Desmond, Charlie, Hawking, Penny to have story closure or even a second of screen time. k? dam.

WWJD?

“Family Friendly”?!? Sayid slits peoples necks, Clair puts an ax in someones chest, 3 people shot in under 5 seconds, and how many other mind disturbing thoughts… and this is just in this season so far… but 2 non-nude scenes make you feel this is a non-family-friendly episode?!?

…uh..ok..I kinda think that the show is not family friendly for the reasons I listed.

Could it be possible 316 could fly again? Lapidus is a pilot, Kate and Sawyer worked on making a runway, Maybe Cindy can be the flight attendent?

I loved that James Ford is the one nick-named: Jimmy, Dimples, Jim all names he has never before gone by (that we have heard). This lead me to think that his underlying issue is one of Identity and knowing himself. Until he gets that truly straight he can never be other than alone. Only Juliet ever did see the real James Ford. Juliet, please step forward -it’s time for that cup of coffee!

@ Yann – alas I think we’ll never know how Sawyer left the cave

@ Rich – I’ll share your cab fare.

@ Stephanie – I agree about the ambiguity but I don’t think Sawyer has completely lost his leadership. He did say to Whidmore that he wanted safe passage for the people he brings on his boat. Despite all the lying he was doing, this seemed genuine.

I can’t say I am on Team Jacob either.

I am now on TEAM SAWYER which means just get off the damn island already. Let Jacob and MIB and Widmore fight it out themselves.

I enjoy the flash sideways connections. It’s part of what made the first season so fun, you never know who is going to show up and in what capacity. I didn’t predict “Charlotte” being Sawyer’s date at all. I can’t wait to see who Miles is involved with, any guesses?

Locke tikka, tikka, tikkas up the cliff, throws down a rope?

There are ladders leading down to a boat?

This is my favorite:

Locke turns to Sawyer, “Wanna go for a ride?”, turns into smokey. wraps a smoke tail around Sawyer, throws him up to the top, wheee!

Wow, a straightforward non-ambivalent declaration. On Lost.

Of course, he could be lying… not.

I can see the t-shirts coming.

Loved the pylons being built on Hydra to keep Smokey out. Didn’t Charles leave the island before Darmaville was built? How does he know about how those work?

How does Widmore know how to get to the island? After all, it was moved by the frozen donkey wheel. Did the bomb going off put it back? Did Jacob somehow lead him there? If so, why? Clearly Widmore and Smokey are enemies but Widmore and Jacob? Didn’t he get thrown off the island by Jacob? I suspect that Widmore is out there for himself trying to take control of the island.

Mirror showed up again with Sawyer smashing it.

1/2 the season gone and I guess I thought I would understand more by this point!!!

@lonestare – Oceanic logo, Battlestar Galactica’s Starbuck painting. Both similar designs with concentric circles. Wonder if that means anything. The circle. BSG’s This has happened before and will happen again. Lost’s What happened, happened. Also, The Wire’s finale did a full circle back to the beginning too.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/51/Oceanic.svg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3552/3407684904_4a75f46cee_o.jpg

Back in The Substitute, when Sawyer was pouring drinks in the kitchen, I pointed I think in this site that the salt and pepper shakers looked like the pylons. I thought it was a stretch, but hey, more pylons!

More numbers. 8:42 – alarm clock, 245, Sawyer’s apartment number.

There was a weird moment, not sure if my memory is failing me, where in the episode, you saw a gun pointing at someone pov exactly like a 1st person shooter game. That was weird. I always thought the show had a bit of a RPG aspect to it.

I was fascinated by the conversation between MIB and Kate. Recent episodes have left me very uncertain about whether Jacob is the good guy and MIB is the bad guy or visa versa. Some of the things MIB said in that conversation troubled me. When MIB talked about his crazy mother I think that he was talking about his own mother, not Locke’s mother, and showing honest emotion. But the motivation for that revelation was to make Kate doubt Clare’s ability to be a good mother. He seems to want Aaron to continue to be raised by someone other than Clare. I am inclinded to believe the warning that it is important for Clare to raise Aaron.

I am very curious about the “growing pains” that MIB mentioned. He keeps talking about being trapped on the island. Has he been held on the island as a prisioner because of things he did during those “growing pains”? Was Jacob his jailor? Does he pose a danger to the outside world if he leaves the island? Ilana said that the candidates are people who might be able to replace Jacob, but has she described Jacob’s job? MIB has said that Jacob’s job was to protect the island from imaginary threats, but has Team Jacob confirmed that?

Watership Down is one of the books that Sawyer read on the island. It was Boone’s book and seeing Sawyer with it is what gave Boone the idea that Sawyer had Shannon’s inhaler. Which led to torture, which led to Sayid going off on his own and being caught by Rousseau which led to . . . .

Besides, what was she going to wear on her bottom half? Her sexy shiny dress zipped up half way with the top half hanging down?

Or did she really think she gets to spend the night the first time she rolls in the sack with a guy and wanted the shirt to sleep in?

Remember in the scene where Ben showed up in Widmore’s bedroom a couple of season’s ago? Didn’t Widmore ask Ben if he was going to kill him and Ben say something like, “We both know I can’t kill you.” At the time I thought it had to do with the island not letting them die, ala Michael and Jack post-island. We now know that it’s because they couldn’t kill themselves. But why couldn’t Widmore and Ben kill each other? I’m wondering if it is something like Jacob and MIB not being able to kill each other (without a loophole.) Apparently, candidates can kill each other but not themselves, as we saw last week. Are Widmore and Ben more than they appear to be? Are they modern versions of Jacob and MIB? Am I recalling that scene in Widmore’s bedroom incorrectly?

Just how big is Island Sawyer’s boat anyway?

Did Alt-Saywer let Alt-Kate go in LA X, because he himself, was on a clandestine mission and it would muddy up his investigation by revealing that he is a cop? Or is it a classic case of one branch of govt workers or public servants having no respect for another brach? (ie-LAPD has no respect for the Department of Homeland Security… cuz that would be down right funny!)

I am SO PUMPED for next week’s episode!!!!!!! I LOVE Richard. I really hope we actually get some answers this time.

This leads to the central question of this episode, derived from the title: does James Ford have the capacity to change? At first blush, it seems he has chosen to follow the alternate path of one who is guided by law rather than subverting it. And yet he maintains his unyielding quest for vengeance. What exactly did he do in Australia to obtain the name Anthony Cooper? Charlotte’s repudiation says it all. James had a chance, but he let his nature prevail.

Will someone please meet me in a taxi and tell me that I’m not crazy when I mention yet another iteration of”open the door” tonight? Sawyer: “Say the magic word and that door bursts open.”

There’s so much to say about how the banyan trees are no impediment to Flocke, about the contrast of the all-seeing eye of the arriving Oceanic and the flaming tiger of the departing Ajira, of disturbed mothers and of the use of hate to further your own ends. I’ll try to post tomorrow if there’s still time.

Please refer to my post right above yours. For a lot of the questions you’re asking there will be no *direct* answer to.

This off-island timeline is based on this quote: “The fluttering of a butterfly’s wings can effect climate changes on the other side of the planet”. One little action can alter everything. Like stepping on a prehistoric cockroach can wipe out humanity.

Technically, the Losties only affected the bomb going off – but that had many repercussions. A rippling effect for each character. Example: After Judhead goes off, Pierre Chang decides it’s time to get off the island. In our first timeline he just sent his wife and son away. Now, for whatever resaon, he goes with. Miles grows up far more self adjusted and lives a life as a cop instead of a ghostwhisperer. Follow me? Changing the future changed far more than the plan just not crashing. Their lives are very different now – Locke and his dad clearly have a different relationship. But the interesting thing for me is how no matter different everything is, it’s still sort of the same… Kate’s still on the run. Claire’s still having a boy named Aaron. Jack still has issues with alcohol.

So no, there will be no direct spelled out answers to those questions you listed. But I think we are meant to understand why those questions even arose to begin with.

Hope that ramble made sense

I’m not sure what it is, but I think that it is something that can kill Flocke; not sure how this applies to the rules but I think it would be interesting if it was actually a person in there….walt, desmond?? hmmmm

PS: highlights of this episode:
all the sawyer screen time (and shirtless scenes!) Enjoyed his flash sideways story
Flocke–don’t know if he’s good or bad, but I do know that he is extremely fasinating and I’m ending up not caring. Just love to watch him–whatever his motives are…for now

djmike68

There was a lot of psychologically-hued stuff tonight, which always pleases me —- such as the bit about “needing someone to hate”

I liked seeing the obvious chemistry between James and Kate off-island, and Sawyer’s wistful look at the sun-dress she was forced to wear when they were locked up in the cages. Even as a cop, he is a rebel, a softie, and a liar — as in letting a sexy woman escape ast the airport

One really stupid thing: Kate’s dress was still in the polar bear cage. Really? Kate’s sex dress just right there? After three years of rain storms, wind, animals running around, not to mention Others? Like, the Others didn’t clean up after Kate and Sawyer ran away? Dumb, dumb, dumb.

And I do agree with the previous posters about too much Sawyer sex. I like Josh Holloway with his shirt off as much as any woman, but I like him with it on too! And I have to say that he and Charlotte…hmmm, no thanks.

I’ve heard so many people saying over this season that they’re afraid all their questions won’t be answered, and I always think, have faith, people! The big stuff will be revealed! BUT… Now I can join the ranks of the freaked. Because that sideways world just keeps bringing up more questions.

What the what happened to the island? We know Ben was there. When did he and Roger leave? Was Miles ever there? Pierre Chang is apparently still in the picture, as Miles says his dad runs a museum. (Unless it’s not Chang, but a different “dad”?) And was Charlotte ever there? Did anyone catch Miles’s last name in the sideways? Was it still Straume? (I didn’t see it anywhere.) And what is the deal with Anthony Cooper? Is the Cooper who conned Sawyer’s parents still Locke’s dad? Or is this a different Cooper altogether? Did Sawyer write that letter? Maybe he was bad, but is now reformed? When did Locke and his dad form their current relationship? **Did Jacob visit our Losties in this sideways world?** GAH! I just keep thinking of more questions the longer I type! There is no way these will all be answered in the next 8 eps!

You wrote: I guess Pierre Chang works in a museum now. Was he on the Island with Dharma like Ben and Roger Linus were? Was Miles there, too?

Correct me if I’m wrong, but I thought the two realities we are seeing are:

Timeline A. Bomb changed the future
Timeline B. Bomb didn’t change the future (bomb was “Incident” after all)

So I would say that in Timeline A, yes, Pierre Chang was on the island, with Ben and Roger (which last week’s episode alluded to) but ultimately left. Why they left, we don’t know, maybe it has to do with why the island is now underwater.

I just ask because there has been A LOT of speculation here, on the podcast, and the internet about where the two timelines break off. I thought it was clear – did I miss something?