I remember hearing that the code changes every morning on one of the videos that played while Ben and his Father “registered” immediately after coming to the island. Does anyone else remember this?

Jacob = John Locke

I remember DL and CC speaking of “Jacob being right in front of us” (or something similar) in one of the official podcasts.

Any thoughts?

Btw, doesn’t it seem to others that Ben didn’t shoot Locke in the kidney area, but rather lower down?

Why did you have to post the link! Of course, my finger had a mind of its own and just had to click!

I will just say this — if this spoiler/synopsis of the final two episodes is accurate, then I can’t think of a more awesome way to end the season.

I can’t wait to find out!

I think the Medical Hatch with that blinking and buzzing fluorescent lamp is just as creepy as Jacob’s cabin.

One quickie on 54439 (fence code): Lostpedia (I think) has posted that it is 7 x 7777. It seems like the original numbers kind of went the way of the Swan Hatch. Maybe the New Numbers are 7’s.

For all of you still confused about the numbers, LostPedia does offer an explanation via the “Sri Lanka Video.” It’s part of last summer’s virtual lost experience. It doesn’t help much with the “how” of the numbers, but it does help with the “why” of the numbers.

I can also see not wanting to look for background information and spoilers outside the show. It is fun to just let the story tell itself, but it also helps to do a little research when you just HAVE TO KNOW!

Thanks for a great site!

Bring back your podcast please!

Bring back your podscast please!

Wasn’t that the Smoke Monster sound? Sounded like it to me.

Regarding the Numbers:

I need some new information about the numbers. Yes, we now know the numbers well enough to spot them when they show up all over the place, in various permutations. That is just the continuing presence of the numbers, however, not more information. It is all what, no why.

Why those particular numbers? Why use them in the Hatch? Why did Crazy Guy In Booby Hatch with Hurley know them? Why, why, why? (OK, I supposed that Hurley connection is as much a “how” as a “why”…)

Also, as to the place where Ben was born, it would be quite a feat to find a spot in Hawaii at any time of the year that looks like Portland in December. Whether or not it was a very cold December that year… There would need to be evergreens all over the place, leaves leaves dropped from the deciduous trees, blackberry brambles filling many of the ditches by the roads, etc. If they could have blue-screened in a shot of the Mt. Hood, it would have been better! Of course, Mt. Hood is generally covered in clouds for most of December.

Disclaimer: I live a couple of hundred miles from Portland, and have only spent one complete winter in Portland. I do, however, get over there several times a winter.

http://www.digitalmediafx.com/Shrek/Images/Shrek06big.jpg

http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c205/spilledmilkinc/jacob.jpg

ABC has now taken cross-promotion to a new level.. aaaargh!

Nuckinfuts says:

You’re killin’ me Smalls.

I………must…………….not……………..do that……but I want to.

I think I can , I think I can, I think I can, I think I can.

There were bound to be some Dharma members who were away from camp or escaped during the purge who had to be “dealt with” later with a bullet to the head. Those people would more likely be at the top of the pile in the mass grave.

She clearly hates Ben. But she feels as though the repercussions of not believeing or disobeying him are far worse than if she does. He’s a terrorist. He’s a sociopath.

Maybe the other Losties would be wise to view Ben this way. He lies with reckless abandon, and if they had just been more skeptical/wary when they first met him (e.g. finished him off like Danielle apparently wanetd to), more people would be alive.

Fernando, I agree that trusting Juliet about the tape seems pretty premature on the part of the Losties–though all the flashbacks indicate Juliet is a good person. She’s somehow under Ben’s sway still, but how/why?

Also, when Sawyer and Kate were “doing it” in her tent, did anyone initially think it was Nikki and Paolo waking from the “dead”?

I also think Jen is right on to be as scared as she is– between Jacob, the fact the Others committed cold-blooded genocide, and Sawyer being manipulated into killing Locke’s father when he was dead set (so to speak) against murder… and there’s serious trouble ahead.

And Dan, can’t do the spoilers– too scared!

*http://forums.buddytv.com/lost-spoilers/5294-new-season-3-spoilers-78.html#post312496*

http://forums.buddytv.com/lost-spoilers/5294-new-season-3-spoilers-78.html#post312496

I have no favorite character on the show because I suspect any one of them could turn out to be a turdhead or a hero; then I’d feel stupid for not seeing the clues. At one time I even suspected the dog Vincent was something he wasn’t. And until Vincent has a flashback, I will still suspect him nonetheless.

I liked your connection of this episode to what Locke had said to Kate a few weeks ago. It really does not make sense that The Others disaprove of her killing her dad, but Ben asked Locke to kill his own father, and he himself gassed his father to death. but we all know that this parent-children dysfunctional relationships have beenplaying a big part in the story. So, I am confident that come 2010, we will understand the whole implications of that.

I also liked very much what Dan from San Diego posted about Juliet knowing there was a response to her initial message on the tape. she should have been as surprised as anybody else about Sawyer having the tape, but instead she just tells him to play the message on the other side. What really bothered me about this, though, is that Ben’s message seemed to have changed people’s mind about Juliet’s evil-ness. If I was there, no matter what I had heard Ben saying, I still would have pushed the issue of her having infiltrated the camp and reporting back to the Others. but that is just me.

Finally, I miss the posts of NorCal Matt. I hope to hear/read from him again!

Peace.

Just some thoughts:

Ben, the only surviving member of the Dharma group, was adopted into the Hostiles group. Jacob was the Hostiles’ leader. Ben somehow managed to overpower and contain Jacob at his present location. It could have been with the cooperation of the other Hostiles or without, but it put him in a position of power and control over the other Hostiles. Ben has not been a benevolent leader and the rest of the group is ready for someone new to dethrone Ben and either release Jacob or assume leadership. This would explain Tom’s, Richard’s and the others’ suddenly standoffish attitude toward Ben and intensified interest in Locke.

Ben’s friend Annie may have also exhibited special abilities that threatened Ben and he may have offed her at some point or she may have been the catalyst that drove him to join the Hostiles in the purge. We will find out later I am sure. I still can’t buy the “Annie is Danielle” theory, although supporters have some good points.

I love the theory that the Hostiles are survivors or descendents of the Black Rock crew. Many directions this theory could go.

I like the way you think!!!

D!

Given the fact that Ben already told Juliet what to do if she was caught (cure the fake sickeness of Claire), maybe Ben also pre-recorded this message just in case Juliet was caught again.

Ben seems to know an awful lot about future events.

I watched a show with Michael Emerson where he gave a hint about Locke. He said a pre-existing condition would help him with his gunshot wound. He then said that he “gave something up” that would actually be an asset to him. I think it’s pretty obvious Ben shot Locke where his kidney would have been had he not donated it to his father. This will save his life. I sure hope so. I know Locke has resolved some of his previous issues, but I don’t want him to leave the show.

Who do you suspect will die in the next two episodes?

How did Juliet know that Ben had left her instructions on the other side of the tape? (When she was trying to prove to the Losties that she really was on their side)

Juliet had no idea of WHEN or how the tape recorder was stolen, and if the tape recording had been stolen shortly after Juliet left it in the Hatch, the recording would have been blank (and never gotten to Ben.. right?)

But Juliet seemed to ALREADY KNOW what Ben said.. and so did Jack.. even though the tape recorder was stolen BEFORE Juliet had heard the message.

Answers? (Unless Juliet knew because of a prior Time Loop experience)

Oh, and I think it’s supposed to be a Sawyer vs. Jack “showdown”, not Locke vs. Jack. That’s probably why they set up that episode with Sawyer testing out being the “leader” and having to be nicer to people…

Image LOST without him; it’s like Star Wars without Darth Vader.

We’ve been shown that Mikial is adept at “field surgery”, first with Sayid and again with Naomi; and evidently has some insight into the unusual healing properties of the Island.

It seems that Locke’s assault on Mikial was a little gratuitous and excessive, perhaps even a bit out of character for Locke. Nevertheless, we had that piece of drama laid before us in a way that was not to be overlooked.

Is Locke now going to be in dire need of Mikial’s services to treat his gunshot wound to save his life… could this be another strange twist to the ironies that seem to plague Locke’s entire life?

Also, if Locke’s fall into the burial pit resulted in damage to his spine, does Locke happen to know any Spinal Surgeons who may also coincidentally be on the Island, and is on sufficiently friendly terms with that surgeon? Or, will he face the dilemma of surviving the shooting but returning to a wheelchair?

Does any of this seem likely or am I missing something… as I said, I’m just guessing. Not a prediction, just a possibility.

I just wanna back up what Connie in Alaska pointed out; the colour of the eyeball appears to be brown, and Locke’s eyes are blue… I just don’t think Jacob is Locke. Also, Locke’s eyebrows sits higher up on his forehead and are lighter in colour.

What happened to the guys up in the winterland - was it Greenland? Haven’t seen much of them lately… Could they be linked to Jacob?

Welcome to crazyland. Namaste, brotha.

Sincerely,

Nuckinfuts

You can also find the same info on the Wikipedia… Just follow the link below:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adewale_Akinnuoye-Agbaje

D!

The actor who played Mr. Ecko (Adewale Akinnuoye-Agbaje) wanted to leave the show to pursue an independent project of his own (a bio film). So the writers/producers wrote his characters off (see the official podcast for more info).

Almost everyone agrees that Mr. Ecko was one of the strongest characters of the show, or at least as important as Jack, and Locke.

WHERE ARE YOU JEN & RYAN??????? We Miss You!!!

Here’s a nit-picky art direction kind of observation:

When young Ben runs out of his house after discovering drunk dad passed out on the couch, notice that the door has an ADA-type door handle - that is, not a “knob” type. Would such handles be in use in whatever year this is/was supposed to be?

At first I wondered why Alex gave Locke a gun. If it’s true that no one has ever seen or heard Jacob, then why would Locke need a gun to protect himself against something that he can’t see or hear? But then I thought that Alex knew Ben would try to kill Locke once he witnessed what Jacob really was. I agree with the person who said in an earlier post that anyone Ben has ever taken to see Jacob has never come back.

I loved the Ben flashbacks. I’ve been waiting for them for a while. I think they are key to the truth about the island. Did anyone ever think that “Help me” was Jacob saying aloud what Locke was thinking to himself? Maybe Jacob can read minds and to prove his existence, he spoke through Ben (that would be the only way Locke could hear him) to show Locke he knew what he was thinking. That would explain why Ben didn’t hear what Jacob said. And if Jacob can read people’s minds, he could be relaying that information to Ben which is why Ben seems to know everything about everyone.

Another theory I had is maybe Jacob took control over Ben while he was still young. There’s a big gap between Ben 12 years of age to the time he killed his father. Who knows what happened in between. At some point Jacob could have possessed Ben and the person we know as Ben is really Jacob. And it was Ben who made a breakthrough to Locke by saying, “Help me.” When the entire creepy ordeal was over and Jacob gained control again, it would be Jacob trying to figure out what Ben said to Locke and not the other way around.

I think Ben’s mom, Ecko’s brother, Leonard, Jack’s dad, and the black horse are Jacob taking the form of those beings to lure the people in to the dark side. Ben did say that Jacob summons people. He tried to summon Jack, Kate, Hurley and Ecko. Ecko died when he followed his brother. Hurley would have died if he would have followed Leonard off the cliff.

I didn’t watch the show when it originally aired but caught up on DVD over the winter hiatus. In the second episode, Locke explained the game of parchese to Walt as “Two players, two sides. One light, one dark.” Does anyone think that’s what’s going on on the island? A good vs. evil thing? Maybe God and Satan themselves? The “ultimate showdown?” The biblical references are everywhere. In the Bible, Benjamin was the son of Jacob. Jacob was Isaac’s son and Isaac of course, Abraham’s son. There was a place in the Bible before Jesus died called Abraham’s bosom where the righteous people awaited Judgement Day.

From wikipedia: Here, the righteous occupied an abode or compartment of their own which was distinctly separated by a wall or a chasm from the abode or compartment to which the wicked were consigned. The latter was a place of torments usually spoken of as Gehenna (cf. Matt., 5:29, 30; 18:9ff, Mark 9:42 sqq. in the Latin Vulgate)- the other, a place of bliss and security known under the names of “Paradise” (cf. Luke, 23:43) or “the Bosom of Abraham” (Luke, 16:22, 23).

I know the writers have ruled out hell and purgatory but this was a bit different.

When Ben started to follow his mother’s spirit, she said it wasn’t time. Almost as if he is some sort of “chosen one” for the dark side. Funny how his mom knew what his name should be after he was born, much like Mary knew what to call Jesus. When Richard learned that Ben had seen his dead mom, he looked surprised. Maybe he thought, “this is the one.”

Anyway, these are just thoughts. Obviously, not everything has a religious correlation but I just thought this was interesting.

I thought Ben’s father looked familiar but didn’t realize he was Uncle Rico. That is exactly why I like coming to this site, you guys really know your stuff!

I also thought that Ben didn’t show Jacob the proper reverence and respect due to someone so “magnificent” as Patchy once called him. Ben has been feeding Jacob some kind of kryptonite and has him under his power.

–Jacob definitely has hair…it’s not a hood or something else

–there is a close up of an eyeball right before John loses it and bolts from the room. Locke’s eyes are blue, but I am pretty sure the closeup eyeball was brown.

–the event that caused the Dharma group’s death is referred to as a “purge”…a very organic term used mostly to describe a biological function or something that happens to a living body.

–Ben seems relieved and somehow invigorated when he discovers Jacob’s words to Locke…”help me”…he could see this as a sign that he hasn’t lost control of Jacob or that Jacob is powerless or that Locke hasn’t upset the balance of power in any way that matters.

–for what it’s worth the numbers young Ben used to disable the sonic fence…54439…5 + 4= 9….9 x 4=36…36 x 3=108..but I can’t work in the last digit “9″…108 divided by 9 =12

Hi TJ!

http://spoilerslost.blogspot.com/

I like the age cap idea but why Roger go over 60 years old and not Richard ?

The textbook they are using is Physical Science

Not all of the 18 posters are shown and I still think it’s funny that the illustrator has Locke in the name…

As to whether this was coincidence… I suspect so. Definitely shades of The Village as noted above. (The whole series is not unlike The Village actually, what with costumes and unknown creatures and maintaining fear of the unknown.) But Ben was born two months early. The Goodspeeds happened upon Ben and Uncle Rico and Dead Mom. Eight-ish years later with Rico Roger down on his luck he gets a break from friendly old Mr Goodspeed (incidentally, NOT an Other and killed in a more or less mass murder by Ben and the Others). That would have to be some really kick-ass planning. Maybe even more complicated than the Ben waiting 20 years or so to massacre the Dhamra folks.

On the one hand, let’s not mistake fate for coincidence.
At the same time, let’s not mistake coincidence for fate.

Another thing I just thought of. I thought it during the episode, then I got distracted by all the crazy stuff happening. Ben seems all scared of Jacob before they go to meet him, then when they get there, he just waltzes in and even talks angrily and aggressively. And then, instead of cowaring, as one may do when a very powerful man throws a telekinetic temper tantrum, he runs up to him and tries to grab him, only to be shoved back.

I just found it strange that he would talk to someone he supposedly respects and fears like that.

I just dont think they would kill off Locke… yet…. I mean Mr. Cuse and Mr. Lindeloff spoke about the Finale being a Locke versus Jack showdown no??? (from SpoilerFix)…

Fuber says “Something on the island has the ability to appear as something or someone else: Ben’s Mom, Ecko’s brother, Kate’s horse. I think it’s that chick from Heroes.”
- funniest line I’ve read here!

If Ben came to the island in the Dharma submarine, and the Dharma people have been killed, who knows how to operate the submarine in order to bring new people to the island?

How did the hostiles get into the compound when Ben was in school? Wasn’t the sonic fence supposed to keep them out?

Kate didn’t seem to blink when she heard that Julliet was supposed to get a sample from “Austin.” Odd? Does Kate suspect she might be pregnant?

80 Nautical Miles = 148.16 Kilometers = 92 Land Miles
130 Kilometers = 80 Land Miles = 70 Nautical Miles

Did the writers goof? Makail said the ship was 130 Clicks away and Naomi said the ship was 80 Nautical miles away.. do we have a bend in the time/space continuum here? (Maybe I remember the numbers wrong)

“Help Me” possibilities..
If Jacob is also Locke, he might be asking the alternate Locke to “Help Me”

HeyBrah says .. Jacob is clearly unhappy with Ben being the human who helps HIM–that’s why he (Jacob) is asking Locke to “Help [him].”

Bill says.. Ben warned Locke about the flashlight — turn that off, Jacob doesn’t like technology — he’s like you.”
- Maybe he is you

Judi In On,Canada Says..”just noticed that the girl that was with “Goodspeed” (the couple, who came across Roger, newborn Ben, and mother), was also the teacher in the class when the “Hostiles” attack”
- Maybe stopping to help Ben’s mom wasn’t an accident by The Others.

Jenn Says… “I read a loose theory that “Jacob” was one of the original psychics Dharma was using in their experiments, but he was too powerful and somehow things went amuck…ending in him being disembodied - or maybe traveling around like the “smoke monster.”
- I heard that theory too, and it could also have something to do with this person mentally pushing the “numbers” out into the real world during a mental telepathy experiement

Tom says.. “Didn’t see any children dead in the compound after the “purge” ”
- Good catch.. children are sacred to The Others

Nuckinfuts Says.. When Ben takes someone to Jacob, or the man behind the curtain ( spirit / pirate / smokey / Noman Bate’s mother…whatever ) it turns we never hear from them again”.
- The best reason to give Locke the pistol.

Ben was told to be patient for the “right time”…
- maybe the right Time-Loop?

Lost Writers.. please, please, please don’t kill Locke.. he’s finally become the Man!

Lost might be the best TV show this decade!

ALSO, something that has not been addressed (I think, I’m pretty sure I read all the posts), the whispers in the jungle after Benry passed through the fence. The whispers were always one of my favorite mysteries, and after I read some of the translations online, I was half-thinking that they were some sort of Dharma thing. But Dharma doesn’t seem to have anything to do with the monster or the whispers. I WANT TO KNOW WHAT THOSE DAMN WHISPERS ARE ABOUT.

And to answer a question I saw in one of the posts, I think the others would not hold Locke back from attacking Patchy because they know he used to be in a wheelchair. I mean, really, if I saw a guy I knew healed like crazy beating up some other guy, I would seriously not think about trying to stop him. Either that or no one likes Patchy. That is a good theory.

I think the following completely contradictory things:
1) It could have been that Cindy was an original Other, as she doesn’t appear to have aged appreciably since the 1960s, and may have infiltrated Dharma.
2) This would mean that maybe the Others brought Cindy out to gather people to flight 815 and then to the island.
3) BUT the Others apparently didn’t expect 815. It was brought down by Desmond’s failing to press the button in time. And they didn’t know who would be on it, since Ben had Ethan and Goodwin scrounging for information. We already know that they didn’t expect 815 to land on the island.

Maybe the actress just looks like Cindy and isn’t her. (Hard to believe that the producers would “accidentally put the actress playing Cindy in another scene if she’s not MEANT to be Cindy.)

Cindy seems to not have nearly as large of a role in the politics of the Others as Richard… she was staring at Sawyer and Kate in the cages. I’m not sure how to explain this all but I don’t think it proves that the Others brought 815 down.

MB — Very interesting thoughts on the birthday. Maybe the Others had Ben do this on his birthday as a renaissance/phoenix rising from the ashes because of the poetry of it. Also it is reminiscent of many religious ceremonies (communion/bar mitzvah) where you become a man/woman on your birthday in the eyes of god. I think Ben metaphorically considers having spent his whole life on the island and metaphorically the day of the massacre to be the first day of the rest of his life… but he clearly admits to not being born there, and everyone but the Losties knows it.

Nuckinfuts — GREAT call on the pit and Alex giving Locke the gun.

Ryan & Jenn… i’m missing your insights!!!

If so, then as she was a flight attendant on 815, they must have known that the flight was going to crash on the island. And also explains how she was taken so quietly without Ana Lucia et al noticing.

Remember, Ben was told to be patient for the “right time”. A time, I suspect, when Dharma had entered a less optimistic period.

Maybe they’re just scared that he’ll do to them what he did to Dharma is they F with him. But Locke isn’t scared of Ben… that’s why they are in awe of Locke.

(Juliet isn’t scared of him either, but she defers to him. She respects him. He has — real or imaginary — power over her sister, and she’s afraid to be skeptical of his claims lest she shever get back to her sister. Locke is so despondent, with nothing in his life off the island, and with so much power on, that he has no interest in ever leaving.)

In no way at this point do I think little Annie ( island orphan? ) is Danielle. Danielle wanted to kill Ben when she had caught him in her trap. I think if she wanted to do that b/c of the past she would have just done it and not brought him to the camp to become Benry.

I think Locke has showed other people “Jacob” before. People who he said Jacob had summoned through him. ( People making a power-play would be my guess ) I think that would account for any gunshot wounds on the pit skeletons. I’m sure most were the gas victims, but since Alex so boldy warned Locke and gave him a gun it seems to me to say : “When Ben takes someone to Jacob, or the man behind the curtain ( spirit / pirate / smokey / Noman Bate’s mother…whatever it turns out to be ) we never hear from them again”.

I was screaming at the TV last night when Locke beat the living daylights out of Mikhail. I also let out a huge gasp when Locke was shot by Ben.

I think Locke will be back….. Remember he was bitten on the hand by his dad. It healed instantly.

Ben is a very creepy dude who doesn’t show any remorse. His seems like a natural born killer.

Overall, this show is driving my wife and I crazy. We haven’t been so attached to one tv show since the the Xfiles left the airwaves.

Another Lost site showed caps of the Jacob shack and I thought I saw a floating dark spot in the chair right before Jacob appeared and it seemeed to be confirmed by the screen cap. Is Jacob tied in with Smoky?

I loved seeing Uncle Rico in the episode. I couldn’t stop thinking about him flinging that steak though lol.

I was glad to see a tie-in that made the infamous throw away episode about the micro bus have more relevance. Little did we know when Sawyer and Hurley were rummaging through it we were really seeing the dead body of Ben’s murdered father.

Could Jacob actually be Desmond, not Locke? Desmond seems to be the one caught in the time loop, not Locke.

Another great episode in what is turning out to be another strong season of Lost.

Some even go farther and say that this dis-embodied Jacob is destined to choose Claire’s baby, Aaron, as his new physical form - based on the psychic predictions Claire was given while she was pregnant. I dunno…sounds as good as other theories I’ve heard, but in the end, they are still just theories!

Pythagoreans…..according to wiki
The organization was in some ways a school, in some ways a brotherhood, and in some ways a monastery. It was based upon Pythagoras’ religious teachings and was very secretive. At first, the school was highly concerned with the morality of society. Members were required to live ethically, love one another, share political beliefs, practice pacifism and vegetarianism, and devote themselves to the mathematics of nature

Just one thing that no one’s mentioned yet - the opening flashback was a definite nod to the film The Village. It looked like they were Other’s on the Island and suddenly they run out onto the road and nearly get hit by a truck - very similar to the Village.

Ryan - I hope you will be writing your opinion on this episode - it would be a helluva episode to miss out!