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Stay LOST!

One more day and hopefully the season finale will explain this all. Stay Lost.

Butterfly Effect definition: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butterfly_effect

This could explain why the “Numbers” are found everywhere the Losties were, outside of the Island.

If this is true, and there is a “Butterfly Effect,” how could some kind of distortion with Time not be involved?

Maybe a group of scientists found an island where time doesn’t pass like it’s supposed to then started the Dharma Initiative to do research.

It’s just a theory. When I first heard the theory of “time distortion” I thought it was stupid, but it HAS got me to thinking.

***Possible Spoiler Alert*******
Hopefully this won’t violate any rules of the forum that I have somehow missed. If I did, my apologies to Ryan and Jenn

-Clancy Brown is listed in tomorrow’s finale castlist as Kelvin (the guy who first brought Desmond to the hatch and later allegedly died). Recall that he was also in a Sayid Iraq flashback as a US commander.

-Harold Perrineau apparently isn’t listed as a regular for next season. If true, this would indicate that the Walt/Michael story arc will be resolved, or put on hold, in tomorrow’s episode.

That being said, I believe everything that is happening on the Island is for reason. Whether the Island is a dream, someone’s fantasy, Purgatory, an experiment gone bad.. far too many events in flashbacks, the numbers, and odd occurrences in real time prove that everything is related, preplanned, destiny, or being controlled by “Him.”

I have a burning question for the Forum..

Do you believe that Time has been, or is being, distorted on the Island?

Billz

I would like to add that there has to be more then 6 stations on island. Maybe there are substations.

HeyBrah thank you for the link. . . . . need to add that one on my list.

As for how “the Others” are I think they are hostile when they want to be but maybe like Mike they need to do what they need to do to figure something out. Or they are part of an experiment along with everyone esle. Or they are the ones doing the experiments on everyone. Who knows, I hope the finale will clear that up.

I cannot wait to see the Desmond flashback. This one is going to be good.

Cho!

The island seems to mean something different for everyone. I don’t know that there will be one common theme for the four names on the list.

I hope Desmond and Alex will figure prominently next season. The seem to be the most intriguing.

Thank you Bryan & Jen for putting this website together. The level of commentary is the most insightful I have found.

We don’t know what they did to Cindy the flight attendant. The only Others who have killed people were sort of “rogues”: Goodwin killed Nate (to throw the tailies off? to avoid being compromised?) and Ethan hung Charlie and beat the snot out of the other Losties who tried to stand in his way/compromise his goal.

Mr Friendly and his crew did also shoot Sawyer, but only when he first threatened them with a gun. They *did* leave Sawyer, Michael, and Jin adrift to potentially drown, but that’s more manslaughter than murder if I remember my Law & Order. Maybe negligent homicide at most. =)

Otherwise they’re been mostly peaceful. Sure, there’s the occasional strangling or rock to the head, but they didn’t shoot anyone in the jungle standoff when they gave Kate back. Michael probably does not know much of this, but he sure knows that if the Others wanted to kill Walt (man, everyone seems to confuse these names, no?) they would have. Whether they want to give him back, keep him, or use him as a hostage, I don’t know.

I also wonder if there’s only a certain group that the Others are allowed to use “lethal” force with… e.g. none of the have had trouble trying to kick the snot out of Ana Lucia, but when Locke was pinned to the floor or Kate captured, they were treated well.

Why wasn’t Bernard at the funeral for Libby and Ana? He and Eko are the only two tailes left and we had a whole episode featuring him a few weeks back, but when it would be appropriate for him to eulogize Ana and Libby he is not there.

As for the “vaccine”: I don’t think it’s a vaccine. At first I thought perhaps it was a sedative (based on Claire’s response to it), but we saw Desmond injecting SOMETHING as part of his waking ritual in the hatch in episode 1 of season 2. Maybe this need to inject something every nine days is similar to the need to hit the button every 108 minutes… another Skinner box type experiment. Also interesting that many of the number obsessions are multiples of nine (every nine days, every 108 (9×12) minutes)…

However, as the group was already willing to release Henry in order to trade for Walt, it still seems like such a stretch for Michael to commit murder. I noticed Mrs. Klugh’s “angry enough” line also and wonder if she gave him the idea directly (and we just didn’t see that part), or if she was just “planting the seed” for the idea, maybe as another type of experiment in human behavior? (to see how far Michael will go?).

Walt’s age…yeah, a problem. It will be interesting to see how they deal with that. It does seem like they don’t know exactly what to make of Walt’s powers (or maybe how to get him to display them?) from all the questions they were asking Michael. At the very least, it seems like Walt can astral project himself?

As far as Walt blurting out that the Others are not what they seem - have any of the characters on the show even made any guesses about who the Others might be? Not to my knowledge - and how strange is that? The know from their own hatch at least, not to mention the one Kate & Claire found and then the one Locke & Eko found, that the island was used for experiments. So it seems like a huge oversight that none of the Losties have had any conversations about who the Others might be (scientists, old participants?). I’m guessing Desmond might shed some light on this in the finale.

David N. - I didn’t notice the thermos scene/preview. Interesting.

I’m guessing the boat at the end must be Desmond’s, as we know he was going to return for the finale anyway.

Dave - I believe Kate’s real last name is Austin - anyone?

The list of four is a little confusing too - I can get Sawyer, Kate and Jack because they are the “leaders” - but Hurley? Obviously he has the numbers connection…. And they aren’t all “good” people (at least in the Other’s eyes I would think Sawyer and probably Kate would definitely be counted out). And as someone else pointed out, if Henry was sent to get Locke, then why wasn’t Locke on this new list? Curious.

nnh334 - I think Eko got to the hatch before Hurley? And he’s not on the list.

Amy - I don’t see how Kate didn’t hear the conversation either. They weren’t that quiet, and the bag on her head just looked like burlap?

John F. - I wonder too if there isn’t another group of Others. **Spoiler** I’ve read next season is supposed to be kind of an “Us vs. Them” theme - the question being who is the “us” and who is the “them.”

And just to agree with everyone else - Michael also is driving me up a wall with “I want my son back” or “I want my boy back” - everyone knows already! I don’t see how they can possibly redeem Michael now, nor how they can kill him off with Walt still being around (and I can’t see them offing Walt/a kid). So what will happen with Michael is one of the biggest mysteries, as some of the Losties are already on to him as of this last episode.

I’m most likely to go with the “monster” making the plane crash, but the Others must have something to do with it as they do have everyone’s name. That makes me think they might be more the scientists than experiment escapees? Unless the theory of “Him” being like a power master psychic is correct and for some reason “He” orchestrated all of the Losties getting on the plane.

I don’t see why Claire would suddenly want to start injecting the “vaccine” after she and the baby have both been fine so far without it (not to mention, everyone else has been fine too). Did Danielle ever say how long it was before all of her shipmates started acting crazy?

Or the producers just didn’t like the whole DUI thing

Another thought to add to the list: Could The Others be comprised of two groups: The “leaders,” represented by Mr. Friendly and his tough, red-neckish, disguise-wearing buddies– and a subset, perhaps mutants, represented by Non-Henry and Ms. Klugh? I.e., don’t Klugh and Non-Henry sound and act remarkably alike? Both have sort of odd. fixated ways of talking and holding their faces, and both seem rather inhuman. Both also appeared to have psychic abiliities to the tune of being able to read Losties motivations, etc. Could they represent an experiment gone awry, but being used by the “leader” others for their own purposes, whatever those might be? Given Hanso Foundation’s interest in genes, mutations, experiments, etc., I thought this might be a possibility. I welcome thoughts!!

Jen, I also wouldn’t be surprised if Walt caused the plane crash, just like you mentioned above. If Walt could create a Polar Bear, then crashing the plane wouldn’t be a problem.

Also, did Walt use his powers to set the rescue boat on fire?

Let’s not forget the question from Mrs. Klugh (Clue), asking Michael if he had ever noticed if Walt was ever where he shouldn’t be.. like at two different places at the same time. This points to the writers tinkering with Time/Space distortion (remember Sawyer reading the book “A Wrinkle In Time” ?)

If the writers are using distortions in space/time, this would easily explain why Michael is now looking older (and taller), all within the span of a few weeks. And also why Shannon was able to see him in the jungle (was he talking backwards too?) when he was supposed to be a “prisoner.”

Why couldn’t the Others go in and rescue Not-Henry? Is that part of the Island off-limits to them, or maybe they know they would have problems being close to the super magnet that is around the Swan Hatch. Hmm.. are the Others real, or a semi-illusion like the white horse, Jack’s dad, Hurley’s friend “Dave” etc..

The question about why Mrs Klugh picked Hurley, Kate, Jack, and Sawyer for the list can also be explained by Time Distortion. These four Losties were the first ones into the hatch after Michael shot Anna and Libby. How did Mrs. Klugh (or someone else) know? If time on the Island isn’t linear, then the Others would already know what would happen when Michael goes back to rescue Not-Henry. Interesting.

They might have “rules” (run past an IRB I’m sure ) as to where they can go and how much contact they can have with the Losties, and maybe they can only intervene under certain circumstances.

Maybe they started out as part of Dharma and something went horribly awry to the extent that they now can’t get off the island?

The one thing (or one of the things) that STILL makes no sense, though, is this: HOW DID THEY DROP SUPPLIES ON THE ISLAND WITH NOBODY ON THE BEACH HEARING OR SEEING A PLANE? The island is small enough to walk across in a few days and the drop occurred in daylight!

I don’t know about anyone else, but it really freaks me out how the Other’s are on a first name basis with all the losties.

Some people on the island have been told by Hurley what his real name is. I believe he told Jack, for one. (He then said the Hurley nickname was a “long story,” which I for one am eager to hear… made me think maybe he has a history of bulemia.) But nobody aside from Locke knew that Sawyer’s name is not Sawyer. (Kate may have known… but I don’t think she knew that his real name was James Ford.)

Michael knew the names of everyone except Sawyer on the list, and Mrs. Clue (or Klugh, not sure where people get the spellings from… is it on the end credits?) tells him who Sawyer is.

As far as the notion that Jack, Kate, Sawyer, and Hurley all saw things on the island… Kate and Sawyer saw the same thing. How is that different from Shannon and Sayid seeing the same thing? Or Boone and Locke/Locke and Eko having overlapping dreams/visions?

I do think (nnh334) that it’s quite an interesting coincidence that the people who returned to the hatch were the people on the Others’ list. I don’t think there’s any way they could have predicted that, for instance, Locke, Eko, Charlie, or Sayid would not have come straightaway to the hatch, given how much time each has spent there and how integral they’ve been in the group. There’s also no way they could have set this up. But it does make me wonder more about the island itself as a source of supernatural power (e.g. Locke and Rose healing rapidly… though we don’t know that Rose is truly cured, she just feels as though she is; Locke is pretty clearly objectively cured, though we don’t know the origin of his paraplegia… maybe a somatization disorder?).

I also wonder — how have Locke’s injured legs healed twice already, but the scar around his right eye persist?

Last, as far as Michale using a compass to go in the right direction… maybe the Others realized that the compass is useless and fed him bogus directions. It would be a lot easier for them to find him… especially if they know where the island’s magnetic pole is or how to change its coordinates. I suspect that was not a continuity error at all.

Many are turning away from what they were (this can also be known as repentance):

1 Eco stops building the church.
2 Charlie repudiates heroin
3 Locke leaves the hatch
4 The Others are not what they seem
5 Michael has “changed.”
6 Sawyer softens up
I would add
7 Jack listened to Michael without really arguing.
8 Claire letting Charlie back “in”

And what of Sayid, who told Shannon that he had also seen Walt? Who has not lied to someone in distress in order to calm them down? Yup, he’s not a on the list either.

Mind you, there is no way I would go anywhere without Sayid. Good thing he’s on to Michael. Just one thing, how many people know that Hurley’s real name is Hugo? Food for thought, but don’t go too crazy!

Yes, please let’s edit the posts.

I’m getting confused….

Anyone else annoyed by these shows going over their alloted time? Desperate Housewives is annoying for this as well.

I should get a TiVO.

Where’s old Jon Locke going? I think the fact that he’s, once again, randomly going off into the jungle alone is a sign that we’re getting the old Locke back. Good! I miss him.

I’ve often wondered about Desmond since he ran off into the jungle a while back. It’s an island. Where’s he planning on going? He might have been lying and really is just one if the others who was placed there to tell that story. A race around the world? Please. Even still, I’m looking forward to maybe hearing his story next week.

I’m done rambling. Can’t wait for next week! Two hours of lost. How delicious.

I have one prediction. This will be short/sweet:

I won’t predict anything other than this, I think Michael will die, probably in the finale…and Hurley will do it.

Hurley is the last person we would expect to take revenge by homocide, but when he accepted Michael’s invite to the hunting party, I think we got a little more insight into what, thanks to the island’s mystical influence, he is capable of. And Hurley DID lay into the village tough guy, Sawyer. Hurley is a sweetheart (which is what attracted Libby, from the asylum to the island), but he has his limits.

To use another example, I didn’t expect Charlie to shoot Ethan, and then he emptied the gun into him. Kind of an overreaction, if you ignore the fact that Ethan DID hang Charlie. He won’t be making THAT mistake again!

Anyway, like I said, short/sweet. God bless. Stay “Lost”.

P.S. My callname is: “…and found 0.5.10.11.19.79″

I remember these things from boot camp back in 1972; we walked through a gauntlet of medics, one on each side injecting us with various meds.

That kid is sour all around. Wrong in the head. I say he’s on the Other’s side now.

Initially, I agreed with Ryan about this episode. Not much to really satisfy…until Walt came around and then my opinion changed entirely.

As a father of two boys just a bit younger than Walt, I can entirely understand Michael’s motivation. To lose a child can set off trauma and panic in the best of parents (all you need to do is look at a parent who has lost their child in a crowded shopping mall to see this exemplified). For Michael, it is a double-whammy: he also lost Walt, against his wishes, initially when Walt’s mother took him. I think his actions, losing Walt a second time against his wishes and seeing Walt in anguish in last night’s episode, are entirely understandable, if not downright expected. Obviously, I still find him an empathetic character.

I can’t wait for Desmond’s reappaearance. Even with brief stints, ‘Lost’ has such interesting characters (Desmond, Ethan, un-Henry Gale, and now Alex).

Finally, after Jen’s ‘Kate trifecta’ remark a few episode’s back, I have to sadly agree with her. I don’t see Kate’s purpose anymore - hopefully Lindelof and Cuse will refresh her character’s purpose in the finale. Lilly’s facial deliveries are just too good to be wasted as window dressing.

And thank god for Sayid! Sawyer seemed suspicious of Michael and even Kate thought he was going overboard, but Jack was just going along.

I’m not sure what I was “intended” to feel, but seeing Michael struck with so many visual reminders of what he’s done and is doing, well.. I actually felt slightly sympathetic.

The others set out to trap Michael and then to fully break him. Was it Walt he was communicating with in the Swan? No, the others appeared to have full control of Walt and I don’t believe he could have gotten that message out. Plus, they were clearly waiting for Michael AND knew his friends were following - did the Swan camera give it away? Is that also perhaps why Mrs. Klugh made the statement to Michael (”They’ll be angry, they’ll do whatever you say.”), because she was aware of the manner by which he left? Regardless, there was a lot of intent involved, further evidenced by the fact that she had Walt waiting right outside the tent for her call. The moment Walt was dragged from the tent screaming was the moment Michael broke.

I wonder what type of advantage Sayid will propose to create, the “double double-cross”? Better to walk into a trap knowing that it’s a trap, but.. you’re still walking into a trap.

That’s my two cents for now. Hope everyone is well!

Sayid’s comment to Jack about a father doing anything for his son was interesting. Did Jack’s dad do something for Jack at the end of his life, which will be revealed later?

Hello Michael…..your hands are tired behind your back and your butt was kicked and you are still demanding the others do what you say. How about a little reverse psychology. Get a grip!

A thought on the Others…they are constrained by something in how they can interact with our guys. I get the feeling that they are also pawns in an experiment, and that they are not the power brokers we had been thinking they were. Maybe they’re trying to solve the mystery of the island just like the rest of us.

Hurray for Charlie having a “good” day.

Ryan and Jen, I still miss The Transmission podcasts! Mahalo for continuing to offer us your after-episode views in writing.

Another “notion” to add to Ryan and Jen’s list that bugged me: Kate should have overheard the conversation between Zeke and Michael, no? If she did, why is she staying quiet? She’s still not told anyone about the fake beards she found….

Sawyer
Kate
Hurley
Jack

Oh, you know those Virgin Mary statues will be floating back to shore eventually…everything always does…the bottle, the raft (what was left of it)…I’m afraid this storyline isn’t quite over.

I cried when Walt and Michael enbraced and Walt said, “Dad, I love you!” I’m such a sap, but I couldn’t help it. I keep wanting to be angry at Michael for the shootings, but then I put myself back in his shoes…what would I do if it were my son? Anything and everything I possibly could, I think.

Herion inside the statue of the Virgin Mary = religion is the opiate of the masses?

Just a cliche or a subplot or a CUSE RUSE?

What about the half broken statue of the Virgin Eko looks at under his shoe on his hunt for the “question mark”? Did anyone notice that the substance on the writing table attached to the chairs in the viewing room of the Pearl station looked like chunks of the herion (same color and clay like appearance) and the little straw left on the table? Perhaps some of the Dharma folks got messed up snorting drugs and things started to go wrong with their mission as they got strung out! I mean come on, aren’t the “others” acting a little crazed?

What surprised me a bit was that they used subtitles to indicate the date: 11 days ago, today, etc. I think they only did the same thing on “The Other 48 Days”.

I’m terribly excited about the season finale, although that’ll mean no more Lost for some months.

Many are turning away from what they were (this can also be known as repentance):

1 Eco stops building the church.
2 Charlie repudiates heroin
3 Locke leaves the hatch
4 The Others are not what they seem
5 Michael has “changed.”
6 Sawyer softens up

But I do believe that even though Walt knows deep down that the Others are lying, he is still willing to do anything to get his son back.

At the end he can tell himself that he did everything he could. He did his Dharma as a father and was not concerned with the Karma of his actions

I think that most of what’s going on with “the Others” and their camp is a red herring. As many folks above have pointed out, we *know* that the Others and their rag-tag appearance is not all it’s made out to be. (Mr Friendly and Alex, at least, have been in hatches at various points… and doesn’t Michael think it’s odd that Mr Friendly’s beard is now significantlylonger and greyer than a few years ago?) Walt also tells us that they’re “pretending.” I have a feeling that beneath some of the canvas covers to the tents are the openings to more hatches. Otherwise, this is just too much to give away in the penultimate episode.

I wonder if the Others weren’t wrong about Walt. (Mrs Clue certainly seemed doubtful.) Maybe they suspected that someone powerful was on the plane and thought it was Walt for whatever reason, but it’s not. And so they’ve broadened their search. Or maybe they just got what they need from Walt. (Blood samples?) Either way, how can Michael be dumb enough to believe that they’d let him and Walt go?

Interesting that of the four people on the new list, three of them (definitely Sawyer and Hurley, and as far as I can tell Kate as well) have gone by at least a partial alias (do we know what Kate’s real last name is? I think she’s used a few.). But Mr Eko, for instance, is not on the list.

And what’s up with Alex? Is she sympathetic to the Losties? Or is she just hoping to get some kind of word about her mother?

I can’t believe I now have to wait a week…

The pile of canisters from the tube, complete with one open book in the last shot.
A picture someone turning a Swan embossed key.
I think it was Desmond running in the jungle, but I have my doubts… looked ALOT more like the guy from the photo Desmond took.

although i didn’t find this episode to be great, it certainly wasn’t a ‘jump the shark’ moment (and Jim you did a great job describing that hollywood terminology). this weeks episode was definately a set-up for the finale (2 glorious hours of LOST — can’t you just taste it???) and offers up just enough questions to knock us outta the park next week … at least according to JJ, who is being quoted in every publication as stating that LOST’s finale is his best ever. i disagree, however, with all the crosstalk about the others living in squalor and not being as techno